ABC chair Kim Williams has denied the ABC takes editorial positions on key national issues in a tense interview with Sky News host Chris Kenny.
Mr Williams said he had “no idea how the overwhelming majority of people at the ABC vote, and nor would I seek to find out”, as the public broadcaster was engulfed by accusations of bias.
Kenny questioned Mr Williams on how he could claim there was no “green left bias”, no position on climate change, net zero or Indigenous issues.
Mr Williams replied: “I’d most certainly contest that with you”.
Kenny said he could not argue there was no “alarmist line” on climate change as an example.
Mr Williams doubled down.
“Chris, I don’t think the ABC is an advocate in any of these environments. It reports in relation to issues of consequence in a disciplined and fair-minded fashion,” he said.
‘HIGHLY INAPPROPRIATE’: WILLIAMS REFUSES TO DISCUSS PRESENTERS’ BELIEFS
Mr Williams also side-stepped commenting on the political views of high-profile presenters as Kenny quizzed him on a line-up he considered stacked with “leftists”.
Kenny brought up “self-avowed leftist” and late-night radio host Phillip Adams and his replacement David Marr, suggesting he was a “green left” journalist.
Mr Williams said he would not wade into assuming their political beliefs.
“Well, there are a number of people at the ABC that have a diversity of views,” he said.
“I’m not here to give individual report cards on commentators or personalities at the ABC… It’d be highly inappropriate for me to do that, and you know that.”
He then said the ABC had allowed presenters of the “conservative persuasion” to host slots as well.
Kenny said the bias he saw did not stop at those two, mentioning high profile ABC presenters Sarah Ferguson, Laura Tingle and John Lyons, and pushing Mr Williams for comment.
Mr Williams said: ” Frankly, I don’t know how they vote, and I don’t know if they vote that they may well register out of issues of principle, a vote that is invalid”.
WILLIAMS BACKS ISRAEL COVERAGE AFTER ABC FACED RC
Mr Williams defended the ABC’s coverage of the war in the Middle East, particularly its reporting on Israel’s conduct.
Kenny pointed to a key error mentioned during Royal Commission hearings last week about an inaccurate report on 14,000 babies being on the brink of death within 48 hours in Gaza.
Mr Williams reiterated the ABC had corrected the story and apologised to its audience before the hearing.
But Kenny said Mr Williams was missing a “key point”.
“I think the important point is that this shows a propensity to always believe the worst about Israel, even if it is completely implausible,” he said.
Mr Williams replied: “Chris, it came from a UN source and from UN documentation”.
“It is a regrettable error, it was corrected,” he added.
Kenny then played a clip of Tingle suggesting the Bondi terror attack had “nothing to do with religion” and a video of Media Watch host Paul Barry counting the times Kenny himself had done segments on antisemitism.
Mr Williams contended he did not have all the context to the latter clip, but rejected they showed anti-Israel bias.
“I think you need to do a much better job in demonstrating that,” Mr Williams said.
Kenny accused Mr Williams of verballing him, and clarified he did not believe reporting had been antisemitic but instead demonising of Israel.
Mr Williams defended the ABC’s commitment to objective journalism.
“The ABC has bent over backwards to try to reflect a diversity of views in relation to really, really unpleasant conflicts that persist in the Middle East, and to do so in a way that reflects the best principles of objective journalism,” he said.
He labelled the ABC’s coverage “one of the most disciplined bodies of coverage… overall of the unattractive events in the Middle East that have happened since October the seventh, 2023”.
‘WHY DID YOU FEEL THE NEED TO GET RID OF JUSTIN STEVENS?’
Kenny quizzed Mr Williams on the departure of former news director Justin Stevens, after news of his departure was unceremoniously broken just before a Senate Estimates hearing.
A cagy Hugh Marks, managing director of ABC News, did little to dispel suggestions Mr Stevens was pushed from the role at the time.
Kenny asked Mr Williams why he felt “the need to get rid of” Mr Stevens.
Mr Williams deflected responsibility to the managing director.
“I think (Mr Marks) has made it very clear that that he wanted to see a different focus. That he wanted to see something that was going to better accord with settings that that measured up in terms of a performance-oriented ABC,” he said.
Kenny then asked if Mr Stevens’ replacement Simon Robinson’s new mission, in part, was to “make the ABC more pluralistic, less biased”.
Mr Williams said he had “every confidence” Mr Robinson held pluralism “very close to his heart”.
“He comes with all of the embedded values of the Reuters Trust principles, which are the oldest set of editorial policies operational on the planet,” he said.
Kenny asked: “Is that an area where the ABC needs to improve under his leadership?”
Mr Williams said “one can always improve” in all things.
Kenny pressed further.
“So you can improve on being more pluralistic, even though there’s no bias problem?” he asked.
Mr Williams shot back: “Chris, you are relentless.”
KIM WILLIAMS ENTERS LION’S DEN
The public broadcaster’s chair agreed to face one of his fiercest critics for the first time on Thursday, after the ABC and its ombudsman fronted the antisemitism Royal Commission last week.
The longtime media executive took the reins at the ABC in 2024, with a proclaimed vision to prioritise bold and robust news coverage.
He has overseen the broadcaster’s news and entertainment offerings in a tumultuous period of continued international conflicts, one federal election, and the nation’s worst ever terror attack.
But the ABC has also made a string of editorial blunders, and issued dozens of corrections, in that time.
Kenny has frequently criticised the taxpayer-funded ABC for perceived “bias” and “partiality” contrary to its legislated charter.
He took umbrage with coverage of the war in the Middle East on multiple occasions and has accused the broadcaster of erroneous and “pro-Palestine” reporting, as well as “green” advocacy.
Mr Williams, who has held a slew of high-profile positions across Australian media and sports, previously criticised the broadcaster for “bland” coverage that often ignored the arts.
“I have an uncompromising view that the ABC is the Australian campfire and I’m very firmly wedded to the notion that it needs to reflect on what the charter means in terms of having contemporary relevance,” he told ABC Radio Sydney upon assuming the role of chair.
Mr Williams has recently insisted the ABC was not biased, before claiming One Nation was a “policy free zone” moments later.
Mr Williams holds one of the most powerful positions at the broadcaster and as a board member has a statutory duty to ensure it maintains independence.
It comes as a recent Sky News Pulse / YouGov poll showed 55 per cent of voters supported moving the ABC away from full taxpayer funding and towards a user-pays model.
ABC IN THE SPOTLIGHT
Just last week, the ABC and SBS were called before the Royal Commission on Antisemitism and Social Cohesion over their reporting on the conflict in the Middle East and antisemitism.
ABC Ombudsman Fiona Cameron said the ABC had at times been slow to correct high-profile errors.
She was also asked whether there had been a broader pattern of “erroneous reporting” critical of Israel that had been corrected too late or inadequately on Thursday afternoon.
Antisemitism envoy Jillian Segal told the Royal Commission that the ABC needed an independent oversight body, after suggesting the broadcaster marked its own homework.
Editorial Director Gavin Fang disputed the need for an additional body.
“I’m not sure how another oversight body might function in addition to that existing oversight body, which already has the power to review and to examine the ABC content,” Mr Fang told the Royal Commission.
Since October 7, 2023, the ABC’s ombudsman has received a surge of complaints, reaching its peak in the months following the terror attacks in Israel.
According to the national broadcaster, in 2024-25, there were 4,192 complaints handled by the ABC ombudsman’s office, more than a quarter of them being related to Middle East coverage.
To date, the ABC ombudsman has recorded breaches for five instances of ABC coverage concerning the Middle East.
The broadcaster said no complaints of bias had been upheld by the ombudsman in relation to ABC News coverage of the Middle East.
A recent Senate Estimates hearing saw those working under Mr Williams in the ABC’s news division grilled on a series of scandals and perceived failures.
Mr Fang was left to defend the ABC’s coverage of the Giggle vs Tickle ‘what is a woman’ case, under heavy scrutiny from Liberal Senator Sarah Henderson.
She also clashed with Managing Director Hugh Marks and told him there was “a culture of defensiveness that needs to be eradicated from the ABC”.
In an exclusive interview with Sky News, Pauline Hanson rejected Mr Williams’ characterisation of One Nation and accused the broadcaster of longstanding political bias.
“They’ve been very biased towards me for many years, even back in 1996 when I was first elected,” Ms Hanson said.
“When you want to report the truth without, you know, having to go at me all the time trying to pull me down, then I’ll answer your questions.”
As well as claims of bias, the ABC has suffered significant reputational damage in recent years, amid a string of editorial failures and public scandals.
The ABC was ordered to pay more than $400,000 to former Australian commando Heston Russell after losing defamation proceedings brought by him.
It was later discovered the ABC doctored a video by adding gunshots to footage of an Australian soldier firing out of a helicopter at what appeared to be an Afghan civilian.
In another high-profile legal case, the ABC was forced to pay $150,000 over the unlawful sacking of journalist Antoinette Lattouf.
The ABC lost further credibility when it was accused of doctoring a speech by US President Donald Trump about the US Capitol riots.
Former ABC News director Justin Stevens resigned recently, following more than 65 corrections and admissions of fault in a single year.
ABC managing director Hugh Marks later admitted the broadcaster had quietly been preparing to replace Mr Stevens for months before his exit.