{"id":943442,"date":"2026-10-28T02:38:18","date_gmt":"2026-10-28T02:38:18","guid":{"rendered":"https:\/\/www.newsbeep.com\/au\/943442\/"},"modified":"2026-10-28T02:38:18","modified_gmt":"2026-10-28T02:38:18","slug":"michael-kirby-lunch-with-the-high-court-judge-about-his-passions-and-career","status":"publish","type":"post","link":"https:\/\/www.newsbeep.com\/au\/943442\/","title":{"rendered":"Michael Kirby: Lunch with the High Court judge about his passions and career"},"content":{"rendered":"<p>He was the High Court\u2019s first \u201ccelebrity judge\u201d and still has students and legal practitioners coming up to him to tell him his judgments are their favourites.<\/p>\n<p>Former High Court justice Michael Kirby retired from the bench in 2009 but continues to be in demand as an arbitrator and speaker around the country.<\/p>\n<p>The 87-year-old lives in Sydney but is in Melbourne ahead of delivering the Brotherhood of St. Laurence\u2019s annual Sambell Oration.<\/p>\n<p>Kirby arrives straight from the airport to meet me for lunch at Streat cafe in Collingwood.<\/p>\n<p>In a quiet backstreet, the cafe has a rare luxury in the inner-city suburb \u2013 a sun-filled grassy courtyard with tables and chairs where we can sit and talk.<\/p>\n<p>I tell Kirby he was my favourite High Court judge when I studied law because his judgments were always interesting and easy to read.<\/p>\n<p>It\u2019s not the first time Kirby has heard this.<\/p>\n<p>Related Article<a href=\"https:\/\/www.smh.com.au\/national\/yield-former-high-court-judge-michael-kirby-s-surprising-relationship-secret-20220726-p5b4ki.html\" tabindex=\"-1\" class=\"sc-cba76dee-0 hdiTqm\" rel=\"nofollow noopener\" target=\"_blank\"><img decoding=\"async\" alt=\"  \" loading=\"lazy\" src=\"https:\/\/www.newsbeep.com\/au\/wp-content\/uploads\/2026\/10\/4bb8c3708db4b026c6eb0f4f49c39eda5d7644e6.jpeg\"  class=\"sc-d34e428-1 ioInpc\"\/><\/a><\/p>\n<p>\u201cEverywhere I go, they want to go up and tell me they learned their law through my opinions,\u201d he says.<\/p>\n<p>It\u2019s a nice legacy to have, I say.<\/p>\n<p>\u201cIt is, but I don\u2019t get carried away with it,\u201d Kirby says.<\/p>\n<p>Such is his popularity that a production of a musical based on his life is currently under way.<\/p>\n<p>\u201cI sort of vetoed it and said I wouldn\u2019t co-operate,\u201d Kirby says. \u201cBut then I wrote back and said if they really want to, they should go ahead.\u201d<\/p>\n<p>He says he\u2019ll go along when it is staged, as long as the musical numbers are decent.<\/p>\n<p>\u201cYou\u2019ve got to have some good tunes,\u201d he says.<\/p>\n<p>Kirby\u2019s popularity is partly due to his judgments written in plain legal English rather than the convoluted and more confusing style favoured by some of his contemporaries.<\/p>\n<p><img decoding=\"async\" alt=\"Lunch with Michael Kirby, comprising a spinach and ricotta roll and an Anzac biscuit at Streat cafe.\" loading=\"eager\" src=\"https:\/\/www.newsbeep.com\/au\/wp-content\/uploads\/2026\/10\/386c1a033f3c072cb8ee2af2129be5cf8020cca4.jpeg\"  class=\"sc-d34e428-1 ldCIuB\"\/>Lunch with Michael Kirby, comprising a spinach and ricotta roll and an Anzac biscuit at Streat cafe.Jason South<\/p>\n<p>\u201cYou can make things easier to understand if you write in short sentences,\u201d he says. \u201cSo that\u2019s what I did.\u201d<\/p>\n<p>Kirby served on the High Court from 1996 to 2009, and during this time he was known for his incisive judgments and for dissenting from the judgment of his colleagues, particularly on matters of civil liberties and human rights.<\/p>\n<p>I ask him if it was lonely dissenting so much, but Kirby says he only really broke ranks when he joined the High Court in response to pressure from parliament \u201cto rein these judges in\u201d, to just apply the law rather than try to address fundamental values.<\/p>\n<p>His rulings, including finding that WorkChoices legislation distorted the constitution, that prisoners deserved the right to vote and that indefinite detention of a stateless migrant was unlawful, attracted the ire of then-prime minister John Howard.<\/p>\n<p><img decoding=\"async\" alt=\"Receipt from lunch at Streat with Michael Kirby. \" loading=\"eager\" src=\"https:\/\/www.newsbeep.com\/au\/wp-content\/uploads\/2026\/10\/a2679a2fe7fd7ac10bf9d54f767a391ea4728413.jpeg\"  class=\"sc-d34e428-1 bRhmzR\"\/>Receipt from lunch at Streat with Michael Kirby. Cara Waters<\/p>\n<p>Howard was often critical of \u201cjudicial activism\u201d, and Kirby returned serve by giving speeches defending the right of judges to interpret laws in light of changing social values.<\/p>\n<p>Even when he was in the majority, Kirby often wrote his own separate judgment \u2013 a record he\u2019s proud of.<\/p>\n<p>\u201cChief Justice Mason once gave a big compliment to me,\u201d Kirby says. \u201cHe said \u2018If you want to know what the case is really about, start with the Kirby judgment\u2019.\u201d<\/p>\n<p>A talent for writing runs in Kirby\u2019s family \u2013 he tells me his grandfather, William Spotswood Knowles, was a journalist for The Sydney Morning Herald.<\/p>\n<p>Sadly, Knowles was a little before my time, so we turn to the menu and Kirby confesses he has already eaten on the plane, so isn\u2019t particularly hungry.<\/p>\n<p>A committed pescetarian, he says Qantas\u2019 catering now finally embraces his dietary preferences.<\/p>\n<p>Instead, Kirby orders a mocha and biscuit, which he carefully nibbles on during the course of our discussion, while I order the spinach and ricotta roll with a carafe of sparkling water.<\/p>\n<p>The pastry is buttery and flaky and the creamy ricotta has a salty tang to it.<\/p>\n<p>It\u2019s good, but Kirby chose Streat more for the cafe\u2019s social impact than the quality of its food.<\/p>\n<p><img decoding=\"async\" alt=\"Kirby pictured in his chambers in 2005. \" loading=\"eager\" src=\"https:\/\/www.newsbeep.com\/au\/wp-content\/uploads\/2026\/10\/dbc3c87db7176f724aa42c2555c5fd46de1bf0ea.jpeg\"  class=\"sc-d34e428-1 ldCIuB\"\/>Kirby pictured in his chambers in 2005. Chris Lane<\/p>\n<p>It\u2019s a social enterprise which provides vocational training and support programs for disadvantaged and homeless youth.<\/p>\n<p>He\u2019s been concerned with social justice since he was given a copy of the Universal Declaration of Human Rights by his teacher as a student at Fort Street Boys\u2019 High School, in Petersham, in Sydney\u2019s inner west.<\/p>\n<p>Kirby studied law at the University of Sydney and practised as a solicitor and a barrister before his appointment in 1974 as the deputy president of the Australian Conciliation and Arbitration Commission. In 1983, he was appointed to the Federal Court, and then the High Court in 1996.<\/p>\n<p>During his time at the bar and as a judge, Kirby was known for his formidable work ethic, often beginning his day at 5am.<\/p>\n<p>\u201cThe Melbourne bar is a late bar, and the Sydney bar is an early bar,\u201d Kirby explains.<\/p>\n<p>\u201cIn the old days, before the internet and emails, you could get a few good hours of total silence. You could focus on the problems of your day, clear your head, get across the issues, and how you will express the issues in your head.\u201d<\/p>\n<p>It\u2019s a habit Kirby continues to this day.<\/p>\n<p><img decoding=\"async\" alt=\"Ralph Heiman\u2019s Radical Restraint, featuring former High Court judge Michael Kirby, is one of the most popular pieces at Canberra\u2019s National Portrait Gallery.\" loading=\"eager\" src=\"https:\/\/www.newsbeep.com\/au\/wp-content\/uploads\/2026\/10\/a49b5499213bd7facff23c0c4f549ee8fee5cc7d.jpeg\"  class=\"sc-d34e428-1 ldCIuB\"\/>Ralph Heiman\u2019s Radical Restraint, featuring former High Court judge Michael Kirby, is one of the most popular pieces at Canberra\u2019s National Portrait Gallery.Heath Missen<\/p>\n<p>He still walks into chambers each day, proudly showing me his watch that shows he has already clocked up more than 6000 steps for the day.<\/p>\n<p>He asks to compare with my watch and is put out that I have eclipsed him with 9000 steps thanks to an early morning run with friends.<\/p>\n<p>\u201cDon\u2019t worry, you\u2019d have me on a normal day,\u201d I tell him.<\/p>\n<p>Since retiring from the High Court, Kirby has not eased up, working with the United Nations and is still in demand as a speaker at universities and for events like the Sambell Oration where he called for a new national approach recognising poverty as a human rights issue.<\/p>\n<p>\u201cThe reason I took this topic was because every day when I walk to work, I see people who are seriously poor, sitting on the pavement,\u201d Kirby says. \u201cSometimes asleep in borrowed bedding, or sometimes with bedding which is handed out to them.\u201d<\/p>\n<p>Kirby says it seems like homelessness is becoming more prevalent and in a wealthy country like Australia, 14.2 per cent of the population shouldn\u2019t live below the poverty line.<\/p>\n<p>\u201cRemember when Bob Hawke promised that <a class=\"inline-link\" href=\"https:\/\/www.theage.com.au\/national\/from-the-archives-1987-hawke-pledges-no-child-living-in-poverty-20220616-p5auce.html\" rel=\"noopener noreferrer nofollow\" target=\"_blank\">no child will live in poverty<\/a>?\u201d Kirby asks. \u201cThe words came back to bite him. But most people would think 14 per cent is quite high for a country like us.\u201d<\/p>\n<p>Related Article<a href=\"https:\/\/www.smh.com.au\/world\/europe\/students-blockade-louvre-as-france-rolls-out-local-curfews-20261020-p616wy.html\" tabindex=\"-1\" class=\"sc-cba76dee-0 hdiTqm\" rel=\"nofollow noopener\" target=\"_blank\"><img decoding=\"async\" alt=\"A protester gestures in front of a burning barricade during a demonstration near Place de la R\u00e9publique.\" loading=\"lazy\" src=\"https:\/\/www.newsbeep.com\/au\/wp-content\/uploads\/2026\/10\/1793155096_473_ceb7ddeb55cea203164d2ca0e79ace67eac7b653.jpeg\"  class=\"sc-d34e428-1 ioInpc\"\/><\/a><\/p>\n<p>Kirby warns about the impact of worsening inequality on society pointing to the <a class=\"inline-link\" href=\"https:\/\/www.smh.com.au\/world\/europe\/the-violence-of-the-streets-of-paris-looked-like-rage-it-revealed-a-society-that-will-take-years-to-heal-20261023-p617yg.html\" rel=\"nofollow noopener\" target=\"_blank\">recent protests and looting in France<\/a>.<\/p>\n<p>\u201cAnd having regard to what we\u2019re seeing in the world at the moment, deep unrest of violence, destruction of public property, it\u2019s a warning to us in this way to keep on top of this\u201d he says.<\/p>\n<p>Still sharp as a tack, Kirby is comfortable discussing jurisprudence from 40 years ago as well as the latest decisions from the High Court where he says, \u201cI keep an eye on areas I\u2019m interested in.\u201d<\/p>\n<p>As well as his public speaking duties, Kirby is presiding over a billion-dollar arbitration in India, which involves occasional travel there.<\/p>\n<p>He has agreed with his spouse, Johan van Vloten, that once the arbitration concludes in about three years he will finally actually retire \u2013 at the age of 90.<\/p>\n<p>\u201cI\u2019ve done a deal, it\u2019s a Trumpian deal that I will retire when I finish it,\u201d Kirby says. \u201cHe says he will believe it when he sees it.\u201d<\/p>\n<p><a class=\"inline-link\" href=\"https:\/\/www.smh.com.au\/national\/justice-michael-kirby-weds-50-years-after-that-summer-of-69-20190211-p50x2q.html\" rel=\"nofollow noopener\" target=\"_blank\">Van Vloten and Kirby<\/a> have been together for 57 years and were vocal advocates for the marriage equality vote.<\/p>\n<p>I ask Kirby what it was like coming out as gay in such a high-profile role, and he says for much of his career he was not open about his sexuality.<\/p>\n<p>\u201cThe deal was: if you don\u2019t make us think about diversity, we\u2019ll leave you alone,\u201d Kirby says. \u201cAnd so that\u2019s what I did, and I continued doing that for quite a while.\u201d<\/p>\n<p><img decoding=\"async\" alt=\"Michael Kirby\u00a0married his partner Johan van\u00a0Vloten on the 50th\u00a0anniversary of when they first met in 1969. \" loading=\"eager\" src=\"https:\/\/www.newsbeep.com\/au\/wp-content\/uploads\/2026\/10\/9b0408202f70f4cc10cc34bc29db9bd209c4850e.jpeg\"  class=\"sc-d34e428-1 ldCIuB\"\/>Michael Kirby\u00a0married his partner Johan van\u00a0Vloten on the 50th\u00a0anniversary of when they first met in 1969. Hadden Motion Pictures<\/p>\n<p>It was van Vloten who convinced him to help blaze a trail for the next generation as he is from the Netherlands where \u201cthey call a spade a shovel\u201d and so told Kirby it was time to stand up for himself.<\/p>\n<p>\u201cWhat can they do to you?\u201d van Vloten told Kirby. \u201cYou are on the highest court on the land.\u201d<\/p>\n<p>Kirby says in the end, van Vloten proved to be correct.<\/p>\n<p>His secret to a long and successful relationship is compromise and mutual interests.<\/p>\n<p>\u201cYou\u2019ve got to have one partner who will always give in,\u201d Kirby says. \u201cThat\u2019s me. You\u2019ve also got to have mutual interests. Ours is history basically.\u201d<\/p>\n<p>Kirby says he sometimes wonders if he should have been a history professor rather than a lawyer.<\/p>\n<p>Related Article<a href=\"https:\/\/www.smh.com.au\/culture\/books\/need-a-new-book-our-picks-of-the-latest-fiction-and-non-fiction-books-20261023-p6163w.html\" tabindex=\"-1\" class=\"sc-cba76dee-0 hdiTqm\" rel=\"nofollow noopener\" target=\"_blank\"><img decoding=\"async\" alt=\"Best books to ready on October.   \" loading=\"lazy\" src=\"https:\/\/www.newsbeep.com\/au\/wp-content\/uploads\/2026\/10\/49adf1d02550b0d1885b94914e3401ccb54d92ad72dcbaee3b72ad8005c1d47a.jpeg\"  class=\"sc-d34e428-1 ioInpc\"\/><\/a><\/p>\n<p>When he retires he plans to spend time talking to van Vloten about the history books van Vloten is reading, while Kirby will spend his time reading the London Review of Books.<\/p>\n<p>\u201cThat is a wonderful journal, all about a lot of books I will never read,\u201d he says.<\/p>\n<p>I ask whether it is cheating to read the London Review of Books rather than the books themselves. Kirby laughs.<\/p>\n<p>\u201cWho\u2019s going to dob me in?\u201d he says.<\/p>\n<p>Our lunch is over and Kirby carefully places the remainder of his biscuit in a paper napkin to take away for later.<\/p>\n<p>He has some parting advice for me as I attempt to digest our expansive lunch conversation into this article.<\/p>\n<p>\u201cShort sentences. Full stops.\u201d<\/p>\n<p>Noted.<\/p>\n<p>Read more great conversations over lunch<\/p>\n","protected":false},"excerpt":{"rendered":"He was the High Court\u2019s first \u201ccelebrity judge\u201d and still has students and legal practitioners coming up to&hellip;\n","protected":false},"author":2,"featured_media":943443,"comment_status":"","ping_status":"","sticky":false,"template":"","format":"standard","meta":{"footnotes":""},"categories":[32],"tags":[64,63,447,134],"class_list":["post-943442","post","type-post","status-publish","format-standard","has-post-thumbnail","category-celebrities","tag-au","tag-australia","tag-celebrities","tag-entertainment"],"_links":{"self":[{"href":"https:\/\/www.newsbeep.com\/au\/wp-json\/wp\/v2\/posts\/943442","targetHints":{"allow":["GET"]}}],"collection":[{"href":"https:\/\/www.newsbeep.com\/au\/wp-json\/wp\/v2\/posts"}],"about":[{"href":"https:\/\/www.newsbeep.com\/au\/wp-json\/wp\/v2\/types\/post"}],"author":[{"embeddable":true,"href":"https:\/\/www.newsbeep.com\/au\/wp-json\/wp\/v2\/users\/2"}],"replies":[{"embeddable":true,"href":"https:\/\/www.newsbeep.com\/au\/wp-json\/wp\/v2\/comments?post=943442"}],"version-history":[{"count":0,"href":"https:\/\/www.newsbeep.com\/au\/wp-json\/wp\/v2\/posts\/943442\/revisions"}],"wp:featuredmedia":[{"embeddable":true,"href":"https:\/\/www.newsbeep.com\/au\/wp-json\/wp\/v2\/media\/943443"}],"wp:attachment":[{"href":"https:\/\/www.newsbeep.com\/au\/wp-json\/wp\/v2\/media?parent=943442"}],"wp:term":[{"taxonomy":"category","embeddable":true,"href":"https:\/\/www.newsbeep.com\/au\/wp-json\/wp\/v2\/categories?post=943442"},{"taxonomy":"post_tag","embeddable":true,"href":"https:\/\/www.newsbeep.com\/au\/wp-json\/wp\/v2\/tags?post=943442"}],"curies":[{"name":"wp","href":"https:\/\/api.w.org\/{rel}","templated":true}]}}