Which I wish he would have done.<\/p>\n
JOE ROGAN: I think he would have been amazing.<\/p>\n
GABLE STEVESON: I think he would have been amazing.<\/p>\n
JOE ROGAN: But it wasn\u2019t around. I mean, when he was wrestling, bare knuckle maybe, I don\u2019t know.<\/p>\n
GABLE STEVESON: Do it on the street or something. He could have found a way.<\/p>\n
The Wrestling Problem<\/p>\n
JOE ROGAN: It\u2019s kind of f*ed that there\u2019s no real professional outlet for actual wrestling.<\/p>\n
GABLE STEVESON: It is f*ed. And wrestling needs a real way to go out there and be something big. And I think they have a really good one now with RaF, if you haven\u2019t heard about it.<\/p>\n
JOE ROGAN: Yes, I have.<\/p>\n
GABLE STEVESON: American Freestyle. They\u2019re trying, and I think they\u2019re trying really well. And I think it\u2019s going to come to a point where how do you make matchups continue? Because, you know, wrestling gets to the point where in fighting, in a lot of the sports, you can get to the point where, you know, maybe you draft a guy in fighting, there\u2019s a next big thing, there\u2019s the next guy out there that you can kind of create.<\/p>\n
And with wrestling, they\u2019re trying to create an atmosphere of how can you create that person? And I like it, and I think it might work. And hopefully it keeps going the way it needs to go.<\/p>\n
JOE ROGAN: It would be interesting if it would. The problem is MMA is so huge now, and people kind of associate wrestling with either MMA or pro wrestling now. Like, those are the two things that they think of. And it\u2019s what I think it\u2019s one of those things like soccer, where soccer should be huge in America. It\u2019s huge all over the world.<\/p>\n
GABLE STEVESON: Right.<\/p>\n
JOE ROGAN: It\u2019s a very exciting sport. But nope.<\/p>\n
American Sports Culture<\/p>\n
GABLE STEVESON: You know, it\u2019s crazy how popular soccer players are, and I feel like in America, we have so many sports that we can\u2019t hit that market for soccer, and I think that might be the biggest case. Why? Because if you go overseas, Ronaldo\u2019s paid $500 million, and if he scores a goal, he gets a million dollars a goal or something. So he\u2019s out here doing bicycle kicks.<\/p>\n
But it\u2019s like, we have so many professional sports that LeBron James is our biggest athlete. But even then, I think it\u2019s at a point where some people see LeBron and, you know, it\u2019s not like the crazy wow factors. If you saw a soccer player in Italy or Spain, it\u2019ll be like, \u201cMan, it\u2019s him.\u201d<\/p>\n
JOE ROGAN: Right? Well, they have less sports, though, right?<\/p>\n
GABLE STEVESON: I think so.<\/p>\n
JOE ROGAN: Italy, like\u2026<\/p>\n
GABLE STEVESON: I think Italy got basketball, soccer.<\/p>\n
JOE ROGAN: Well, they\u2019re not really known for basketball, though. Soccer\u2019s big. Boxing. There\u2019s a lot of boxers come out of Italy, but other than that. Rome. Yeah.<\/p>\n
GABLE STEVESON: They got a couple fighters, but other than that, I think we\u2019re kind of at a halt with creating that big guy for America.<\/p>\n
JOE ROGAN: Well, it\u2019s just strange to me because it\u2019s such a\u2026 Wrestling itself is such an exciting sport. It really is very exciting to watch, and everybody understands it. It\u2019s not complicated, I think.<\/p>\n
GABLE STEVESON: I really think everyone understands it to a certain extent, I think, but they\u2026<\/p>\n
JOE ROGAN: Could learn points and all the other stuff.<\/p>\n
GABLE STEVESON: Have you ever wrestled?<\/p>\n
Joe\u2019s Wrestling Background<\/p>\n
JOE ROGAN: Yeah, wrestling in high school, just one year. I was doing Taekwondo at the same time because I was doing Taekwondo and I couldn\u2019t do both of them at the same time. And I was pretty good at Taekwondo.<\/p>\n
GABLE STEVESON: You know what\u2019s crazy? I think since you\u2019ve done Taekwondo, maybe I should try.<\/p>\n
JOE ROGAN: You are such an athlete. You\u2019d probably be awesome at it.<\/p>\n
GABLE STEVESON: I might be able to pull it off. I don\u2019t know if I can get to your level.<\/p>\n
JOE ROGAN: Well, you would figure it out, man. You\u2019d figure it out. Are you flexible?<\/p>\n
GABLE STEVESON: It depends. How and what are we doing?<\/p>\n
JOE ROGAN: Well, you would get flexible. The thing is, a guy like you\u2019d figure out how to get flexible. The flexibility thing drives me nuts because I\u2019ve tried to show stuff to guys before, MMA fighters, and they\u2019re like, \u201cI\u2019m not flexible.\u201d I\u2019m like, \u201cWhat does that mean? What does that mean?\u201d This is not like you\u2019re not tall, okay. You can get flexible.<\/p>\n
GABLE STEVESON: Okay.<\/p>\n
JOE ROGAN: You just stretch.<\/p>\n
GABLE STEVESON: Okay, we can rewind now. And I could say, I am flexible.<\/p>\n
JOE ROGAN: Well, you certainly could get flexible.<\/p>\n
GABLE STEVESON: You can.<\/p>\n
JOE ROGAN: Anyone can get flexible, but it\u2019s not\u2026<\/p>\n
GABLE STEVESON: Can you get flexible? Do you want to get flexible?<\/p>\n
JOE ROGAN: That\u2019s a good question.<\/p>\n
GABLE STEVESON: Do you want to do something?<\/p>\n
JOE ROGAN: This is a good question. It\u2019s a lot of work to get flexible. And would it compromise anything? You know, some people say it compromises some stability, you know, to have completely over flexible hips and flexible joints, that it could possibly compromise some stability that maybe\u2026 But, I mean, Yoel Romero is pretty f*ing flexible.<\/p>\n
The Yoel Romero Phenomenon<\/p>\n
GABLE STEVESON: And he\u2019s explosive.<\/p>\n
JOE ROGAN: Crazy, super explosive, bro. How about that match with Pat Downey?<\/p>\n
GABLE STEVESON: He went out there and made Pat Downey look like a beginner wrestler. And it\u2019s crazy because Pat Downey is\u2026<\/p>\n
JOE ROGAN: Really good, but really good.<\/p>\n
GABLE STEVESON: Yoel\u2019s 48.<\/p>\n
JOE ROGAN: I know, 48 shooting blast doubles like\u2026<\/p>\n
GABLE STEVESON: He just like he\u2019s back in 2004 Olympics.<\/p>\n
JOE ROGAN: It doesn\u2019t make any sense. He\u2019s a freak. He\u2019s a real freak, man. And I mean, he\u2019s 48, allegedly. We don\u2019t even really know how old he is because he\u2019s from Cuba.<\/p>\n
GABLE STEVESON: How old do you think he is, for real?<\/p>\n
JOE ROGAN: Oh, I don\u2019t know, man.<\/p>\n
GABLE STEVESON: 35 at this point.<\/p>\n
JOE ROGAN: I mean, he\u2019s obviously at least 48, but it\u2019s just crazy.<\/p>\n
GABLE STEVESON: But you know what the best part about it is? When guys get older and they kind of get a little bigger, they don\u2019t look good in a singlet. And this is crazy to say, but Yoel looks really solid in that singlet.<\/p>\n
JOE ROGAN: Oh, bro, he looks solid everywhere, man. He\u2019s still got a six pack.<\/p>\n
GABLE STEVESON: Still does.<\/p>\n
JOE ROGAN: And, you know, now he\u2019s doing dirty boxing, and he\u2019s still fighting MMA. He\u2019s just\u2026 He\u2019s a freak. I mean, and we really didn\u2019t even get him in MMA until he was past his athletic prime.<\/p>\n
GABLE STEVESON: Yes.<\/p>\n
JOE ROGAN: I mean, he really started fighting in the UFC. How old was he when he first fought in the UFC? I want to say he\u2019s like 35.<\/p>\n
GABLE STEVESON: I don\u2019t know that, but it seemed really late because when he was going through Olympics, he was sound in every position. And like you said, I mean, in a couple interviews back, if he would have started that early. Just imagine. Oh, my God, just imagine.<\/p>\n
Freak Athletes in MMA<\/p>\n
JOE ROGAN: Yeah, but that\u2019s the thing that you have, too, is athleticism. And the thing about MMA is the real freak athletes, they go to football, they go to basketball, they go where all the money is, and they go where all the traditional sports avenues are, and it\u2019s just not\u2026 There\u2019s not a lot of freak athletes that wind up making their way to MMA. And when they do, they really shine.<\/p>\n
And, you know, when I first started seeing you competing, you know, first, obviously, in wrestling, and, you know, if you can win a gold medal in the Olympics in wrestling, I mean, you have to have everything. You have to have everything. You have to be a freak athlete. You have to be unbelievably dedicated, disciplined. Nobody gets there easy. No, that is not, you know, \u201cOh, he\u2019s just gifted.\u201d It doesn\u2019t exist. You got to have everything.<\/p>\n
GABLE STEVESON: There\u2019s got to be a lot of tools.<\/p>\n
JOE ROGAN: A lot.<\/p>\n
GABLE STEVESON: A lot of tools.<\/p>\n
JOE ROGAN: A lot of tools and a lot of fortitude. The thing about wrestling that I\u2019ve always said is not only is it the best base for MMA, because if a guy can dictate where the fight takes place, that is the most important aspect of fighting and you can learn everything else, but it\u2019s also\u2026 It\u2019s the mental toughness that wrestlers have, the ability to grind out those practices, the conditioning that\u2019s involved in wrestling, it\u2019s above and beyond, I think, all other sports.<\/p>\n
MMA Wrestling vs. Traditional Wrestling<\/p>\n
GABLE STEVESON: Yeah, I think it\u2019s the next level thing. And you see in UFC right now, the guys that are dominating and winning are kind of putting that wrestling base first, but making it MMA wrestling.<\/p>\n
You know, I feel like when a lot of guys, a lot of D1 wrestlers come to MMA, they kind of don\u2019t make the switch of how to take the right shot and how to finish the right shot and how to use your feet to trip their feet out on the cage. And if you get stuck in a guillotine, how do you move from that spot?<\/p>\n
And I think you see the guys that are doing it best, the Islams, the Hamzats, are really going out there and attacking and making sure that people can understand that, \u201cHey, you got to fear this.\u201d And then next I\u2019m going to come with the hands.<\/p>\n
And so I think that\u2019s the biggest thing that we\u2019re working on now, is that I\u2019ve wrestled my whole life, and I\u2019ve done great things and won the Olympics and multiple national championships, but I think the main thing is going out there and understanding that you are that bad dude. But when you show them hands now, you got to have to respect both. And I think that\u2019s where a lot of this is going to come into play when I finally get to that point of reaching that competition.<\/p>\n
Gable\u2019s Striking Journey<\/p>\n
JOE ROGAN: Now, how long have you been striking for?<\/p>\n
GABLE STEVESON: I\u2019ve been going into a little\u2026 So I\u2019m from Minnesota, Apple Valley. I\u2019m actually from Portage, Indiana. I moved to Apple Valley, Minnesota when I was 11 years old. And in college I met a guy named Billy Simon. He\u2019s from Prior Lake. He fought nothing too big, just on a regional scene in Minnesota.<\/p>\n
He has a house on Prior Lake and he has a place in his basement that is built out for MMA and stuff like that. When I was maybe 21 years old, I started hitting the pads and mind you, stiff as a board, don\u2019t really know what I\u2019m doing. But he\u2019s kind of started and guided me along the way.<\/p>\n
JOE ROGAN: And how old are you now?<\/p>\n
GABLE STEVESON: I\u2019m 25.<\/p>\n
JOE ROGAN: So just four years.<\/p>\n
GABLE STEVESON: Just four years. But I think really, really striking. Seven months.<\/p>\n
JOE ROGAN: That\u2019s so crazy, really after it.<\/p>\n
GABLE STEVESON: So crazy, really time consuming. \u201cHey, this is what I want to do. I\u2019m not going to wrestle. I\u2019m doing MMA.\u201d I would say seven months, but\u2026<\/p>\n
JOE ROGAN: When you watch your dirty boxing match, I would have never believed that, except I know what an athlete you are. It\u2019s just\u2026 It\u2019s so crazy how someone who really knows how to use their body can learn other things.<\/p>\n
Training with the GOAT<\/p>\n
GABLE STEVESON: Well, I think the main thing also is I\u2019m all ears. You know, you can\u2019t go out there and think that you can do something without putting that time and effort in like we talked about with the Olympics or like you talked about.<\/p>\n
But I think the main thing is if I can go out there and be all ears and soak up game from the people that are trying to show me the way, I think I can do a lot of great things, and that\u2019s all I do. I\u2019m all ears. I want to show up twice a day. I want to do the best thing that I can. If I got to show up three times a day and I feel like it, I\u2019m going to go do it.<\/p>\n
JOE ROGAN: Because it\u2019s also to be an elite athlete like yourself, you have to be coachable. You have to really like the guys who already know things. Like, \u201cI\u2019m going to do it my way.\u201d They never get elite.<\/p>\n
GABLE STEVESON: It doesn\u2019t work. No. And I think you got to put that guard down. You got to trust somebody, and if you don\u2019t trust anybody and, man, I think I can do it alone. I think I can kind of wing it. I think I can maybe not practice today. You got to trust somebody and you got to put your heart into somebody.<\/p>\n
And I feel like I have a good group of people around me to kind of put that heart into, and they\u2019re leading me in the right direction, and I\u2019m grateful.<\/p>\n
The Buffalo Bills Experiment<\/p>\n
JOE ROGAN: So you were doing a bunch of different things, right? So you become an elite wrestler, and then for a while, you were thinking about playing football. So you played football for a short amount of time.<\/p>\n
GABLE STEVESON: Buffalo Bills? Yeah.<\/p>\n
JOE ROGAN: Yeah. How long do you play it for?<\/p>\n
GABLE STEVESON: I never played football in my life.<\/p>\n
JOE ROGAN: Never played?<\/p>\n
GABLE STEVESON: No. That was the first. Hey, that was the first time I ever played football. I promise.<\/p>\n
JOE ROGAN: That\u2019s crazy. First time you played football was professional?<\/p>\n
GABLE STEVESON: It was in the NFL. My mom was always scared. The high school coaches at Apple Valley High School in Minnesota were like, \u201cHey, come play football.\u201d They were trying to call my mom and dad, and I\u2019m like, you\u2019re not going to convince her. She is scared to death of football the whole time I\u2019m wrestling. So where do we bridge this gap at?<\/p>\n
JOE ROGAN: Right, right.<\/p>\n
GABLE STEVESON: And I just get done with WWE, and I go out there, and I\u2019m chilling. I get a call saying, \u201cHey, you want to try out for the Bills?\u201d And I tell Sean McDermott and Brandon Beane, and I said, \u201cHey, don\u2019t expect much, but I could put on shoes. But I\u2019ve never had football cleats on. I never had pads on. I don\u2019t even know how to put the tights on anything.\u201d<\/p>\n
And I went out there and I sprinted my ass off, though, in that tryout. I was sprinting down and back and forth. I said, \u201cHey, if I don\u2019t know any technique for D line, you\u2019re going to see effort.\u201d And McDermott saw effort, and that\u2019s all he needed to see, and he gave me a chance.<\/p>\n
JOE ROGAN: What was that like? Jumping into a completely new sport.<\/p>\n
GABLE STEVESON: Hard. Because it\u2019s not just football.<\/p>\n
JOE ROGAN: How old were you when you did that?<\/p>\n
GABLE STEVESON: I just turned 24.<\/p>\n
JOE ROGAN: Wow.<\/p>\n
GABLE STEVESON: I just turned 24. I know you see it. You see that stance? That\u2019s the beginner stance. That\u2019s the beginner stance. But I came out there, no gloves, just winging it, and I told them, just give me a good chance.<\/p>\n
But football is not just football. It\u2019s the playbook. And the playbook is crazy, because I went from, \u201cHey, go out there and wrestle someone one on one\u201d to \u201cSee if the guard is light on his feet or see if he\u2019s leaning forward to see if the center is going to silent count, maybe, or see if the guard taps the center to snap the ball.\u201d There\u2019s a lot of different things that you got to know.<\/p>\n
And I\u2019m out there with this big ass helmet on. I\u2019ve never put a helmet on, Joe. So I\u2019m out there with this big ass helmet.<\/p>\n
JOE ROGAN: My head\u2019s down and I can\u2019t\u2014<\/p>\n
GABLE STEVESON: Look up and I don\u2019t know what I\u2019m doing. But I knew if I gave effort that someone would give me a chance. And I went out there in my first game, I think I had a tackle, a QB rush, and I was kind of unheard of at the time because I\u2019ve never played ball before, but it was crazy. Once in a lifetime experience, most definitely.<\/p>\n
The NFL Journey Continues<\/p>\n
JOE ROGAN: And when you got cut, did you think about trying somewhere else? Did you think about doing it more?<\/p>\n
GABLE STEVESON: Once I got cut from Buffalo, I was the last one to get cut from the room. I remember going in to see McDermott and they were going to do practice squad, but I knew they were going to do practice squad. So I was like, \u201cYo, just send me home. I\u2019ll figure it out. I\u2019ll try again.\u201d<\/p>\n
So my plan was to go back to college and wrestle already, but I sat around for maybe a month. Baltimore Ravens called me, and Baltimore was like, \u201cHey, do you want to come to a tryout?\u201d I said, \u201cOkay, you know, I never played football before, just to let you know, if it\u2019s a little shaky.\u201d<\/p>\n
I went out there and I dominated the tryout. And I had like 10 minutes of work, but it was a great 10 minutes. And they\u2019re like, \u201cOkay, we\u2019re going to take your physicals. You\u2019re going to be here and stay.\u201d The injury report comes back and the injury report says they need a D end and a linebacker. So you got to compensate for the spot because you need someone to play next week.<\/p>\n
And I probably needed like six weeks on practice squad to play. And so I get sent home, they say, \u201cGive me a week, we\u2019ll bring you back.\u201d A week comes, they don\u2019t bring me back. And so I\u2019m like, \u201cOkay, I see the writing on the wall, let me move on.\u201d<\/p>\n
I sit for a little bit. Indianapolis Colts call. They just got ran over by a team. They said, \u201cWe need a run stopper.\u201d So I go out there, do the trial. I think it went well. They said, \u201cWe\u2019re not taking anybody today.\u201d And then from there I was like, you know, maybe this is not it. And so I went back to wrestle.<\/p>\n
The MMA Decision<\/p>\n
JOE ROGAN: Did you ever think about MMA at that time? Was it in the back of your head?<\/p>\n
GABLE STEVESON: MMA was in the back of my head since the Olympics. But I wanted to make sure that if I was going to go to MMA, that let me try things first before going all in on something that I need to go all in on. And I did my tryouts, I did my things, and now I want to go in all in on something that is finally here.<\/p>\n
JOE ROGAN: And when your mom was scared of you doing wrestling, how did she feel about you doing MMA?<\/p>\n
GABLE STEVESON: Oh, you know, she\u2019s sh*tting off. Oh, my God. She can\u2019t even watch. She didn\u2019t even watch me wrestle. And so now I\u2019m like, \u201cMom, I got a dude about to punch me in the face. Maybe if he can get to me. Are you sure you want to come and watch?\u201d And she\u2019s like, \u201cYeah, I\u2019ll come watch.\u201d<\/p>\n
And she comes, has a good time and has her drinks, and when I step out, I\u2019m like, \u201cWhere were you?\u201d \u201cOh, I was in the back.\u201d So you didn\u2019t even see me fight? Why you even come then? So out of the three fights I\u2019ve had, she\u2019s sat in the back and she\u2019ll be like, John will go and get her and be like, \u201cGable\u2019s done.\u201d And she\u2019ll be like, \u201cOh, what happened?\u201d And John will be like, \u201cGood, it\u2019s all day.\u201d<\/p>\n
JOE ROGAN: So did she get nervous? Is that what it is?<\/p>\n
GABLE STEVESON: Oh, my God. She\u2019s sweating. She\u2019s nervous. But I kind of give her that look of like, if this is one of them ones, I\u2019m going to tell you, but I haven\u2019t gave her those looks yet, so no.<\/p>\n
WWE Experience<\/p>\n
JOE ROGAN: So when you make this\u2014so you decide football\u2019s not going to happen, WWE is not going to happen. You did like one televised match with WWE?<\/p>\n
GABLE STEVESON: I did, yes.<\/p>\n
JOE ROGAN: Right, yeah. What was that like?<\/p>\n
GABLE STEVESON: Honestly, I had a great\u2014from me being real and honest, I had a great experience. I have nothing wrong with anybody there. TKO was great. Triple H, Paul Levesque was great. Stephanie, Vince, everybody was great. I just had a competitive drive that I needed to get out. And so, you know, when you have that gap is there, you can\u2019t do both.<\/p>\n
JOE ROGAN: Right.<\/p>\n
GABLE STEVESON: And I was trying to bridge both. And I wasn\u2019t giving my 100% to the business. And if I\u2019m not going to give 100% to the business, then you might as well X me out because it\u2019s already over with. So that\u2019s practically how it happened.<\/p>\n
JOE ROGAN: Yeah, no slight on pro wrestling, but it\u2019s just like, if you really want to compete\u2014<\/p>\n
GABLE STEVESON: You got to get it all out.<\/p>\n
JOE ROGAN: Yeah.<\/p>\n
GABLE STEVESON: And so I would love to go back in the future. I would love to do a sport and go out there and dominate, and then\u2014<\/p>\n
JOE ROGAN: Hey, maybe after the UFC Heavyweight Championship, for sure.<\/p>\n
GABLE STEVESON: Maybe after a couple times. And so I would love to go, and if it meant well, and I would do it again, most definitely, because I have no hard feelings to them, and that\u2019s how it goes.<\/p>\n
Making the MMA Transition<\/p>\n
JOE ROGAN: So when you make the decision that you\u2019re going to go into MMA, what is that like? What are the steps that you take?<\/p>\n
GABLE STEVESON: I got done with NCAAs, and I said, I flew down to Miami. I met with John and a couple other people, and I said, \u201cHey, I want to fight.\u201d You know, Jon had me in his camp.<\/p>\n
JOE ROGAN: So we\u2019re talking about Jon Jones. And did you know Jon before this?<\/p>\n
GABLE STEVESON: I knew Jon because I knew John from Instagram. John likes wrestling, so I knew John from IG. He sent me a DM. He sent me his number. And if you know John, he don\u2019t answer the phone worth anything, and it\u2019s crazy, but he sent me his number. He said, \u201cCall me.\u201d<\/p>\n
So I called him. And this was before he got hurt for the first Stipe fight. He was like, \u201cI want you to come practice with us. You know, I want a wrestling partner.\u201d I left him and played football. The next year comes\u2014no, I\u2019m sorry. I don\u2019t even know where I was at at the time, but skip, we go, and he\u2019s like, \u201cI want you to come back for the second camp.\u201d He\u2019s going through it. Me and John hit it off like that.<\/p>\n
JOE ROGAN: Wow.<\/p>\n
GABLE STEVESON: We hit it off.<\/p>\n
JOE ROGAN: So when you guys started training together in camp, is that when it really sunk in your head when you\u2019re like, \u201cThis is what I want to do\u201d?<\/p>\n
GABLE STEVESON: Yeah, he really\u2014I needed somebody to kind of engrave it in me. With the wrestling, I had my father, I had the University of Minnesota. I had a lot of good people around me, kind of say, \u201cHey, this is how we\u2019re going to do it. This is where you need to go, and this is how it\u2019s going to happen.\u201d<\/p>\n
And when I saw Jon, I saw that drive of like, \u201cD*mn, you know, this guy\u2019s winning. And people get close, but they can\u2019t get past him. And why is that?\u201d So I really sat back and watched his mental. And how he went about a lot of things. How he talked to people, how he greeted people, how he walked, how he punched, maybe how he looked when he was in the pocket, when he needed to get out, when he rested his hands.<\/p>\n
And I saw everything and I was like, \u201cWow. Man, this guy\u2019s a superstar, super superstar.\u201d And we all know that, and people know that for a long time now, but I really saw him and I was like, \u201cD*mn, I want to be that.\u201d And that\u2019s what flipped my switch right there.<\/p>\n
JOE ROGAN: What an amazing opportunity. You know, you haven\u2019t done any MMA and you get to go in there and train with the goat.<\/p>\n
Training with the GOAT: Jon Jones<\/p>\n
GABLE STEVESON: It\u2019s crazy, man. You know, it\u2019s hard to explain. I tell people, people ask me all the time, what was it like seeing Jon for the first time? Because I\u2019m 25, so when Jon was super peak, I was 12, 13 years old. And I\u2019m looking at this guy beat Gustafsson and Reyes and Thiago Santos and stuff like that.<\/p>\n
So it\u2019s different. You see a different side of people. And when I saw Jon, I was like, wow. I\u2019ve seen you for my whole life and I get to see you in person. How cool is that?<\/p>\n
JOE ROGAN: And for people that don\u2019t even know the close fights that Jon had, they were really only close because Jon wasn\u2019t training. That\u2019s really all it is, 100%. Jon was partying and he was what I would call playing with his food. He didn\u2019t like to, the Gustafsson fight is a perfect example. Didn\u2019t train at all for the Gustafsson fight.<\/p>\n
I mean, I talked to Greg Jackson and he was like, I swear to God, he barely showed up. I\u2019m like, that is so crazy. And then he gutted it out in the last rounds. That\u2019s what\u2019s crazy. It\u2019s a close decision. But he wins the fight by gutting it out in the final rounds when he\u2019s done relatively no strength and conditioning.<\/p>\n
GABLE STEVESON: Nothing so crazy, fantastic to see.<\/p>\n
JOE ROGAN: Then really gets motivated for the second fight with Gustafsson, blows him out, smokes him, blows him out, which is what you expect when Jon is in prime form. He\u2019s the greatest of all time, most definitely. For you to be able to be a young guy who\u2019s thinking about MMA and train with the greatest of all time now two division world champion, it\u2019s crazy.<\/p>\n
GABLE STEVESON: Amazing opportunity. And it\u2019s amazing because you don\u2019t see the guy that\u2019s. You see the best of the best right away.<\/p>\n
JOE ROGAN: We\u2019re back. So anyway, where were we?<\/p>\n
GABLE STEVESON: Jon Jones.<\/p>\n
JOE ROGAN: Yeah. So you\u2019re saying you, so you were talking about what it\u2019s like to first start training with them. So you had no MMA training really before that at all. You had just been doing a little bit of striking with this guy.<\/p>\n
GABLE STEVESON: Joe, I kid you not, I didn\u2019t even know really how to defend punches.<\/p>\n
JOE ROGAN: That\u2019s crazy.<\/p>\n
GABLE STEVESON: I didn\u2019t know how to defend punches. And you probably saw a video of him throwing the knee at me because I\u2019m so hard headed. I\u2019m like, let me shoot on Jon. But whole time I forgot he\u2019s a national championship wrestler, right?<\/p>\n
So I didn\u2019t even know how to defend a punch, I didn\u2019t know how to defend a kick, I didn\u2019t know how to do anything. But I went in there and I said, hey, if you need somebody, it\u2019s got to be me. And that\u2019s how hungry I was. And I feel like that\u2019s how kids should be nowadays about getting that opportunity. Man, just be hungry because someone\u2019s going to respect you.<\/p>\n
JOE ROGAN: Yeah, for sure. But I mean, not a whole lot of people get that opportunity. That\u2019s a crazy opportunity. It\u2019s also like Jon is an elite wrestler as well. And so learning how to incorporate elite wrestling into all the other aspects of MMA and to be able to go right into camp with Jon is just, this is amazing, incredible opportunity.<\/p>\n
GABLE STEVESON: Super incredible. I\u2019m grateful for it every day. And especially he\u2019s still here in my corner to this day. We talked this morning. He\u2019s still giving me all the pointers, all the advice, even when we\u2019re not even fighting, just telling me how I should say things, what I should say, how I need to go about life, how I need to go about business and meeting people and greeting people. So it\u2019s a true opportunity.<\/p>\n
JOE ROGAN: That\u2019s awesome. That\u2019s really awesome. So when you\u2019re in camp with him, you\u2019re going through the camp. Were you planning on MMA then? Or how does it work? What were you thinking the moment you started training with him? Is that when it really started, the fire in you?<\/p>\n
GABLE STEVESON: Yes, I had a little bit of burn for it, but in the\u2026<\/p>\n
JOE ROGAN: Back of your mind.<\/p>\n
GABLE STEVESON: Yes, but a little burn. You got to have the heart. You got to have the heart. So what kind of, what was the stamp on? It was, I went to Madison Square Garden with him, and Jon was just doing Jon things, just being a superstar. Everybody knew who he was.<\/p>\n
And I was like, man, you know, I got Olympic gold medal, maybe I should be getting some too. Jon showed me the way a little bit, so I\u2019m trying to have him show me the way. He\u2019s bringing me to every place, meeting every person, showing me the opportunities that he has. And he looks at me, and he was like, \u201cYou can have this, too.\u201d<\/p>\n
And that was kind of the cherry on the top, but we can put another cherry on the top and do a double one when he won the fight. And then I\u2019m holding the belt with him, and I got to see this guy face to face. And he\u2019s just the most popular man on earth for that day. And it\u2019s kind of like, wow.<\/p>\n
You don\u2019t really get to see the backstage moments. You get to see the guy go out there on TV and fight, but I got to see the backstage of everyone taking the pictures with him, the superstars. I\u2019m walking out the Knicks game, and I see Queen Latifah, and I\u2019m like, damn, that\u2019s Queen Latifah. And I\u2019m taking a selfie with Queen Latifah. I\u2019m like, yo, can I send this to my mom? And she\u2019s like, yeah, go ahead.<\/p>\n
And I see Fat Joe talking to him and everybody. And I\u2019m like, wow. This is what it is to be a real fighting star. And fighting is one on one, and people want to watch someone fight. But I think in other sports, like we talked about earlier, there\u2019s a full team with helmets on, with jerseys on. But in fighting, people want to meet that badass dude and they want to meet the champ. And that\u2019s what I want to be.<\/p>\n
The Fight IQ Advantage<\/p>\n
JOE ROGAN: Yeah. So what is training with Jon like? What is the training camp like? When, you know, you obviously haven\u2019t gone into training camp with any other elite fighters. But one of the more interesting that separates Jon from everybody else is Jon doesn\u2019t take no short notice fights. Jon game plans for everybody. He studies them.<\/p>\n
His fight IQ, I mean, obviously he has everything. He obviously has all the skills, obviously has all the drive and everything else, but the fight IQ is the big one. That\u2019s the big one. Because if you don\u2019t have a good driver, who gives a f* how fast your car is?<\/p>\n
GABLE STEVESON: True.<\/p>\n
JOE ROGAN: It\u2019s really the mind behind it that puts it all together.<\/p>\n
GABLE STEVESON: He\u2019s sitting in a Ferrari with Ferrari gas. A lot of people sit in a Ferrari with 87 gas, and the car don\u2019t work. So when I got to see those tendencies of him watching people, and he does it to me now, where he\u2019ll send me videos on Instagram of the top UFC guys.<\/p>\n
Big, oh, watch how he steps. Watch when he throws a punch, how he comes back and he doesn\u2019t reset this certain way. And he\u2019s kind of already installing those tendencies in me. And so now when I was wrestling, I never used to watch people wrestle. I went out there on a limb and I was just beating guys. Even in Olympics, I never watched anyone wrestle. I never watched their film.<\/p>\n
JOE ROGAN: Really?<\/p>\n
GABLE STEVESON: Never. I told coaches, don\u2019t show me one video because I don\u2019t want to focus on that one thing he did. And that was me being hard headed. If a guy had a great double leg, and I\u2019m like, damn, how do I stop this double leg? And I\u2019m worried about stopping a double leg instead of doing my offense.<\/p>\n
And so I never watched anybody. I went to the Olympics and I said, show me the guys I\u2019m wrestling. And I said, let\u2019s do it. The only guys right there banging their\u2026<\/p>\n
JOE ROGAN: Head against the wall listening to this. Damn. He did that to me. That\u2019s crazy.<\/p>\n
GABLE STEVESON: I said, let\u2019s do it. I said, it\u2019s me or you as do or die. And this tournament, I\u2019m not dying. You can\u2019t beat me in any way possible. And that\u2019s when I was at my best, when I had that mindset. And he\u2019s kind of putting that back into me, and I feel really good about it.<\/p>\n
The Future of Heavyweight<\/p>\n
JOE ROGAN: That\u2019s amazing. It\u2019s amazing. So when he\u2019s sending you videos, do you have a, do you save all this s? Do you have a folder? We have all these different fighters and different moves because you\u2019re basically brand new at something. But let me just tell you what I said. You had a fight, an MMA fight, where you hit that dude with a left hook and then took him down while he was out cold. I sent Dana White a text message. I said, \u201cEveryone\u2019s fed.\u201d<\/p>\n
GABLE STEVESON: I did. Well, I appreciate it.<\/p>\n
JOE ROGAN: Thank you. Because I was like, that kind of speed is crazy. That kind of speed and incorporated with elite wrestling is crazy. I\u2019m like, what do you, the heavyweight division is so shallow right now. You got Tom Aspinall, Ciryl Gane, Jon Jones, if he chooses to fight again, Francis, if some, by some miracle they can work something out and bring him back to the UFC.<\/p>\n
Other than that, there\u2019s no one compelling for a championship caliber fighter. It\u2019s, there\u2019s basically four or five guys on earth that are in this championship caliber class, and you\u2019re already there, which is nuts. And you haven\u2019t even fought in the UFC yet.<\/p>\n
When I watched you move and I watched you fight, I was like, okay, how do you stop that? Who\u2019s got the skills to be able to stop that? And in my mind, there\u2019s only a few guys where it\u2019s going to be a problem. There\u2019s the Francis Ngannou, the Ciryl Ganes and the Tom Aspinalls. That\u2019s it.<\/p>\n
There\u2019s a few guys and everybody else on the way up. The only problem is going to be you getting fights. That kind of speed is just bananas for a 250 pound man. And when you have that and you\u2019re 25 years old, it\u2019s a very rare thing that you see in MMA.<\/p>\n
And it\u2019s kind of crazy because the heavyweight division is of course, the most prestigious division in the world. The heavyweight champion of the UFC is the baddest motherf*er on the planet. And right now it\u2019s kind of a toss up because Ciryl Gane had this fight with Aspinall. Jon is kind of semi retired. Whatever he decides to do, it\u2019s kind of up in the air. He\u2019ll probably have one more fight, right?<\/p>\n
GABLE STEVESON: I want him to. I think he\u2019s got the juice in him.<\/p>\n
JOE ROGAN: The White House.<\/p>\n
GABLE STEVESON: Yeah, he would love the White House. He\u2019s told me many times he wants to be main event on the White House, and he wants me to be a couple slots behind him and kind of have us both win. And that\u2019s his last leg right there. I would love for him to do one more if he really wanted to. In his heart he should. But if he doesn\u2019t, Jon\u2019s not going to do it.<\/p>\n
JOE ROGAN: They should do Alex Pereira and him at the White House.<\/p>\n
GABLE STEVESON: I told people, I said Alex Pereira would be a great matchup for Tom.<\/p>\n
JOE ROGAN: A heavyweight version of the BMF belt, you know what I\u2019m saying?<\/p>\n
GABLE STEVESON: It\u2019ll be perfect. There\u2019s nothing else to it besides two guys going out there. It\u2019s Alex Pereira, the baddest light heavyweight, and it\u2019s Jon Jones, baddest heavyweight right now. And regardless if someone else has the belt, Jon Jones is still the badass heavyweight out there.<\/p>\n
JOE ROGAN: The belt doesn\u2019t mean jack shit when it\u2019s Jon Jones.<\/p>\n
GABLE STEVESON: It doesn\u2019t.<\/p>\n
JOE ROGAN: You know, there\u2019s so many fighters could do that. They could just step away from the belts, abandon the belts and then come back. And it\u2019s really just about the fighter. Everybody knows who Jon is, everybody knows what Jon does. It\u2019s like, people will pay to. You don\u2019t need a belt. That belt doesn\u2019t mean anything.<\/p>\n
Jon Jones\u2019 Unstoppable Training Camp<\/p>\n
GABLE STEVESON: Yo, this is a crazy story. I had a French bulldog that passed away. So I like to go out there and I adopt French bulldogs, and I kind of give them a better home and I either ship them to a new home or I keep them. And so at the time, I had a baby French bulldog. He passed away. And I told Jon, I was like, \u201cYo, my dog died, I got to go home.\u201d He let me go home.<\/p>\n
I came back and I came back on a Tuesday. I didn\u2019t see Jon till Thursday. And mind you, this is a week before he\u2019s going to go out there for Stipe. He\u2019s sick, like super sick. And I watched this guy do five rounds on a Thursday and they shark baited him, five new people and he\u2019s dead tired.<\/p>\n
And this is when I knew he was unstoppable. He went out there, nobody could touch him. And I\u2019m telling you, high class PFL fighters, ex UFC fighters, ex Glory kickboxers were going in there after him, and he was just mopping them. And I was like, \u201cDamn, this dude is beyond next level.\u201d<\/p>\n
And that was like, you know, you got to see greatness, and I see it at the fight, but you also got to see it when, how does this guy be great before the fight? And I saw that and I was like, \u201cGod damn.\u201d I said, \u201cExcuse me, Jon, you think I can go in there with you?\u201d<\/p>\n
JOE ROGAN: And he was like, no.<\/p>\n
GABLE STEVESON: And I was like, \u201cWhy do you think so?\u201d He was like, \u201cYou don\u2019t know how to defend.\u201d And it was kind of a funny joke because a partner got hurt. And I was like, I raised my hand, I told Greg Jackson, I said, \u201cGreg, let me in there.\u201d And Greg was like, \u201cNot today, Gable.\u201d<\/p>\n
And this is when I didn\u2019t know how to defend or anything. He was like, \u201cGabe, not today.\u201d And I was like, \u201cMan, why? You know, I can go in there and take him down.\u201d And he was like, \u201cThis is different.\u201d<\/p>\n
And when I saw that, that was like the epitome of like super greatness in my eyes. Because I like hard workers. I like guys that beat on guys. I don\u2019t like guys that go out there and do the little extras that they to look cool. I mean, just go out there and dominate and let\u2019s go home. And I saw that and I was like, \u201cYeah, it\u2019s over with for Stipe. It\u2019s going to be a long night.\u201d<\/p>\n
JOE ROGAN: Well, unfortunately, they met when Stipe had already had a lot of miles on the clock.<\/p>\n
GABLE STEVESON: A lot, a lot of miles.<\/p>\n
The Perfect Spinning Back Kick<\/p>\n
JOE ROGAN: And Jon was still elite. It\u2019s crazy that Jon essentially developed a spinning back kick, a real spinning back kick, when he\u2019s 36 years old.<\/p>\n
GABLE STEVESON: Crazy.<\/p>\n
JOE ROGAN: It\u2019s so nuts because, I mean, he tried it earlier in his career, but it was like he would spin instead of go straight, you know what I mean? But when he hit Stipe, it was perfect. It was perfect. That picture, we showed a video of it and then freeze, froze the heel, it was halfway into his rib cage. It was crazy.<\/p>\n
GABLE STEVESON: I wouldn\u2019t have got up either.<\/p>\n
JOE ROGAN: Well, very few people would. Very few human beings can take that kick. It\u2019s so powerful. And when it comes from a big guy like Jon with those long ass legs and all that leverage with perfect technique, and it goes right into the sweet spot like that, like, good luck.<\/p>\n
But it\u2019s such brilliant thinking on his side, because he\u2019s like, \u201cOkay, I have to fight heavyweights, and I need something that can take them out with one shot. Like, what is that?\u201d Well, it\u2019s the most powerful kick, which is the spinning back kick. And so he trains it constantly.<\/p>\n
GABLE STEVESON: Constantly.<\/p>\n
JOE ROGAN: You know, which is just, very few people have the mindset to be able to do. Very few guys develop new skills late in life, you know, late in their career, they start incorporating new skills like that.<\/p>\n
GABLE STEVESON: I think that\u2019s a thing where he was, he\u2019s always all ears, too, and that\u2019s kind of what he\u2019s putting into me also. I watched him do a spinning back kick the night before at midnight when we were practicing in the hotel lobby.<\/p>\n
JOE ROGAN: So he was just planning on that?<\/p>\n
GABLE STEVESON: He was planning on it, the showstopper. He told me he wanted to take Stipe down, and then all of a sudden, he does a spinning back kick. And I was like, \u201cYou sly motherf*er.\u201d<\/p>\n
JOE ROGAN: Did he bring in a Taekwondo coach? How did he develop that technique so far?<\/p>\n
GABLE STEVESON: He\u2019s got a, there\u2019s a kickboxing taekwondo coach named Alex. He\u2019s got a long, he\u2019s got a long last name because I think he married a Thai lady. So I think he changed his last name. But he\u2019s from New Mexico. He works out of Jackson. He\u2019s got a lot of tattoos on him, and nobody, if you saw him, you would never know, but the dude can kick hard as shit, and it\u2019s crazy.<\/p>\n
JOE ROGAN: And so he worked with Jon on that?<\/p>\n
GABLE STEVESON: Yes. Yeah.<\/p>\n
JOE ROGAN: The only other guy that I would say developed a crazy new technique late in his career was Vitor. When Vitor was like 35 or 36, he developed a wheel kick. It was crazy. Out of nowhere, when he fought Luke Rockhold, all of a sudden he\u2019s throwing wheel kicks. Like, Vitor never threw wheel kicks.<\/p>\n
GABLE STEVESON: That\u2019s crazy.<\/p>\n
JOE ROGAN: Crazy. Vitor never threw wheel kicks.<\/p>\n
Watching Fighters Evolve<\/p>\n
GABLE STEVESON: Crazy. But I think it\u2019s honestly got to be cool from, because you sit right next to the cage, so it\u2019s got to be cool to see people grow up through their career. And then all of a sudden, at the end, you see a guy does a spinning wheel kick or a guy does a spinning back kick, and you\u2019re like, \u201cDamn, where\u2019d that come from?\u201d<\/p>\n
And I feel like, does it give you a high to kind of see a person grow through a new stage of seeing a new move from them?<\/p>\n
JOE ROGAN: I just love excellence. That\u2019s what I love. I love when someone shines, when they just figure a way to eclipse everyone else. When they figure a way to, when they just, like the Petr Yan Merab Dvalishvili fight.<\/p>\n
When you see a guy like Petr Yan who loses the first fight to Merab and comes back and dominates in the second fight, I love that shit. I love it. I love watching someone put in an insane amount of work and dedication and then shining on fight night. I love it.<\/p>\n
GABLE STEVESON: It\u2019s cool too, because you see, Petr Yan is the new blueprint for guys that are coaching kids to do moves. I mean, he went out there and threw a fake hook and liver kicked Merab. And then he goes out there and he hits a sotagari and trips guys.<\/p>\n
I mean, what other film tape blueprint can you use from someone else? I mean, he\u2019s done everything in all of his fights. His flow state is amazing.<\/p>\n
Petr Yan\u2019s Mastery<\/p>\n
JOE ROGAN: His flow state\u2019s incredible. And he\u2019s so good at mixing up trips along with inside fighting. His stand up is so good. He\u2019s so hard to hit clean too. I think the only guy who really hit him clean was Sugar Sean. Sean hit him with a knee, like a really good knee, timed it perfectly in their fight and dropped him.<\/p>\n
But other than that, he very rarely gets hit. And when you do hit him, you\u2019re hitting him and he\u2019s kind of rolling with it, you know, he keeps that super high guard. He does, huh? Yeah, he keeps his hands straight in front of you. He\u2019s something special, man. And you know, that dude\u2019s still only 32 years old.<\/p>\n
GABLE STEVESON: He\u2019s only 32.<\/p>\n
JOE ROGAN: Yeah, I know, it\u2019s crazy.<\/p>\n
GABLE STEVESON: What do you think if he doesn\u2019t\u2026<\/p>\n
JOE ROGAN: 32 or 34. How old is Petr Yan? He\u2019s either 32 or 34, but, you know, we\u2019ve seen him and I think he\u2019s 32.<\/p>\n
GABLE STEVESON: 32?<\/p>\n
JOE ROGAN: Yeah. I mean, we\u2019ve seen him in the UFC since he was like in his mid-20s.<\/p>\n
GABLE STEVESON: Yeah. If he doesn\u2019t lose to Merab that first time, where do you think his path goes?<\/p>\n
JOE ROGAN: It\u2019s a good question, you know, I mean, because he did lose to other guys as well. He lost to Sean and he lost to, the Aljamain fight was fed. The first fight was fed, but the second fight, Aljamain dominated him.<\/p>\n
But I think he probably overestimated himself in the second Aljamain fight. It doesn\u2019t seem like he was just prepared. And the thing about Aljamain is his wrestling is very good and his back control is the f*ing best in the business. When Aljamain gets your back, you\u2019re in deep shit. He\u2019s so good at back control. He\u2019s so good at rear naked chokes.<\/p>\n
And you know, Aljamain just really struggled to make that 135.<\/p>\n
GABLE STEVESON: It\u2019s got to be hard.<\/p>\n
JOE ROGAN: Oh, but if he got it right and he got it right in that second fight, you know, and he just did what he does at his best. It was one of his finest performances. So he lost that fight, but it didn\u2019t mean that he was done. It just mean he realized, \u201cOkay, he had to have a camp like he had for Merab in order to beat Aljamain.\u201d<\/p>\n
You know, and I just don\u2019t think everybody\u2019s willing to go through that kind of camp every fight. Merab went through four.<\/p>\n
GABLE STEVESON: Yeah, I think so.<\/p>\n
JOE ROGAN: Four in a year.<\/p>\n
Fighting Frequency and Sustainability<\/p>\n
GABLE STEVESON: Yeah. For blueprint. How do you like that? Because I know guys kind of take the two fight a year approach. Maybe three.<\/p>\n
JOE ROGAN: If you\u2019re doing well, I think that\u2019s more sustainable. Alex Pereira did the same thing. He\u2019s fought a lot of fights and he\u2019s fought fights short notice. You got to admire that mindset of a guy who\u2019s like, \u201cI don\u2019t give a f*, let\u2019s fight.\u201d You know, and, but Alex has fought with broken toes.<\/p>\n
GABLE STEVESON: He\u2019s done everything.<\/p>\n
JOE ROGAN: He fought with a norovirus and, you know, he had a f*ed up hand the first time he fought Ankalaev. But then, you know, same thing. He comes in for the second fight with Ankalaev fully healthy and just smokes him. Smokes him in the first round.<\/p>\n
GABLE STEVESON: If you, what do you think about if you gave Alex Pereira like a solid great wrestler, like an Islam of light heavyweight, heavyweight. How do you think that he does?<\/p>\n
JOE ROGAN: It\u2019ll be a problem. Yeah, I mean, I think less of a problem certainly now than early in his career. Like, if you see his first fight in the UFC with Michailidis, he gets taken down the first round. That\u2019s not going to happen now. And if it does, he gets up.<\/p>\n
You know, it\u2019s different, but it gets up against, who does he get up against? A guy like you, you know, it\u2019s a different, there\u2019s different levels. Right. You really saw that with Jack Della Maddalena and Islam. Right? There\u2019s levels. And when you got a guy that\u2019s at Islam\u2019s level, that\u2019s just a super elite grappler. Unless you face that before, you don\u2019t know what to prepare yourself for.<\/p>\n
GABLE STEVESON: I think people all the time, that\u2019s\u2026<\/p>\n
JOE ROGAN: The thing with Petr Yan. He had been in there with Merab for the first fight, and so he knew what to expect. And he\u2019d seen all those crazy fights. He saw the fight with Sandhagen, he saw the fight where the rematch with Sugar Sean, where he submitted him, he\u2019s like, \u201cOkay, this guy\u2019s a f*ing monster. He\u2019s a monster now. You got to prepare for a monster.\u201d And he was ready.<\/p>\n
But unless you\u2019ve experienced that before, there\u2019s really no one like that in the light heavyweight division, unfortunately, there\u2019s not some super elite grappler in the light heavyweight division. And I think that\u2019s one of the reasons why Khamzat is thinking about going up to light heavyweight.<\/p>\n
GABLE STEVESON: And I think he should. I\u2019m a big fan of Khamzat. I love his style. I love his intensity. His intensity is the best thing ever.<\/p>\n
JOE ROGAN: Oh, he\u2019s an animal.<\/p>\n
GABLE STEVESON: It\u2019s the best thing ever to watch. Because when I was wrestling, I like to go out there and just put the hammer down and dominate. And he\u2019s got it. He\u2019s got that touch.<\/p>\n
JOE ROGAN: Oh, yeah, he\u2019s an animal. And that animal part of him almost killed him because he refused to stop training when he had Covid. When he had Covid, he was just showing up at the gym and putting in two and a half hour sessions and vomiting blood. It\u2019s nuts.<\/p>\n
GABLE STEVESON: That\u2019s crazy. Yeah.<\/p>\n
JOE ROGAN: They said the real problem with Hamzat was that you couldn\u2019t get him out of the gym, and he was always over trained. So then he brings in Sam Kalavita. And Sam Kalavita, training lab, right?<\/p>\n
GABLE STEVESON: Yes.<\/p>\n
JOE ROGAN: So he\u2019s monitoring his heart rate, he\u2019s monitoring his recovery, and he\u2019s working on him with his strength and conditioning. And they\u2019re doing it scientifically. And then you\u2019ve seen the Dricus du Plessis fight. I mean, he just didn\u2019t gas at all.<\/p>\n
GABLE STEVESON: That was the same thing as Islam and Madeleina. Very similar. They tried to do the, maybe what if he can outbox him? But it\u2019s hard when you got to worry about so many things.<\/p>\n
And I think Islam did a great job of showing the leg kicks, making Jack switch. Jack didn\u2019t really push forward. And Islam, when he did shot the double or he shot an outside single. And that\u2019s hard. It\u2019s hard when you got to think about so many things.<\/p>\n
The Evolution of Elite MMA Striking<\/p>\n
JOE ROGAN: Yeah, well, Khabib is without doubt one of the all time greats, one of the greatest to ever do it. But the difference between Khabib and Islam is Islam is elite, stand up wise. Khabib was a very good standup, but Islam knocked out Volkanovsky with a head kick. That\u2019s not in Khabib\u2019s repertoire.<\/p>\n
Islam is on another level. It\u2019s one more level above. He can knock you out standing, he can knock you out on the ground, he could submit you, he could take you down. He\u2019s f*ing huge for the weight class, especially 155.<\/p>\n
There\u2019s so many aspects and you\u2019re always thinking about that grappling when you\u2019re striking. So when you say who\u2019s better striker, Islam or Jack Della Maddalena? Well, it depends. Because if you got to worry about that takedown, your striking is not going to be the same. It\u2019s just not going to be the same because everything he does, you\u2019re always looking for that takedown. And that factor leads to guys getting hit all the time.<\/p>\n
GABLE STEVESON: Yeah.<\/p>\n
JOE ROGAN: If you go back and watch old fights like Kevin Randleman versus Cro Cop. Kevin Randleman knocked out Cro Cop because Cro Cop was worried about the takedown. He was worried about the takedown. All of a sudden, randomly comes with a big left hook.<\/p>\n
GABLE STEVESON: And Kevin Randleman was a NCAA champ. Where?<\/p>\n
JOE ROGAN: Ohio State, I believe. Wasn\u2019t Ohio State. I believe he was Ohio State.<\/p>\n
GABLE STEVESON: 184 or 197. Was he heavyweight?<\/p>\n
JOE ROGAN: I don\u2019t know. Three time Big Ten wrestling champ at Ohio State.<\/p>\n
GABLE STEVESON: What? Whoever won the tournament? Heavyweight. Wow. Who do you lose to in the tournament? Oh, it says heavyweight. I\u2019ll look that up real quick.<\/p>\n
JOE ROGAN: Okay, but that was the thing about Randleman. The speed and the takedown was always this big threat. And so because of that, you\u2019re thinking about one thing and boom, you get hit with a big shot.<\/p>\n
The Old Days of MMA<\/p>\n
GABLE STEVESON: I\u2019ve seen Kevin Randleman wear shoes in his matches. What\u2019s the early days? What\u2019s the difference of wearing? I seen a guy wear shoes now. I was on Instagram, I saw maybe a kickboxing match or something like that. Why can\u2019t they wear shoes now? Is there a rule that you can\u2019t?<\/p>\n
JOE ROGAN: It\u2019s not now. All those things are old.<\/p>\n
GABLE STEVESON: Those are old.<\/p>\n
JOE ROGAN: Yeah, those are all old. Pride used to allow you to wear shoes.<\/p>\n
GABLE STEVESON: Okay.<\/p>\n
JOE ROGAN: Early UFC used to be able to wear shoes.<\/p>\n
GABLE STEVESON: I saw that. Yeah, I remember. The first UFC video I seen was that big Hughes dude and that little dude that knocked him out. Was he the big black dude? Which guy? It was an old video.<\/p>\n
JOE ROGAN: Super old. That\u2019s not descriptive enough.<\/p>\n
GABLE STEVESON: Okay, give me a second.<\/p>\n
JOE ROGAN: Big, huge dude.<\/p>\n
GABLE STEVESON: Bobby sat maybe?<\/p>\n
JOE ROGAN: No, that wasn\u2019t you.<\/p>\n
GABLE STEVESON: Who was the big video?<\/p>\n
JOE ROGAN: And then the white dude came out.<\/p>\n
GABLE STEVESON: There, and he was just whooping him, and the big dude tried to grab him. I might be tripping, but I saw the video.<\/p>\n
JOE ROGAN: Well, I don\u2019t think you\u2019re tripping. I mean, there\u2019s been so many fights. It\u2019s so hard to figure out what fight you\u2019re talking about. But there\u2019s an advantage to wrestling shoes, for sure. Without a doubt. I mean, the grip on the ground. I mean, how many times you\u2019ve seen guys? Yeah, it is one. Oh, Keith Hackney. Yeah.<\/p>\n
And Keith Hackney had a very strange style. It was like, I think he was a Kempo guy. And he hit him with a bitch slap. Like, you ever see how he knocked him down? Look at the difference in the size. Emmanuel Yarborough, who is a sumo wrestler, but Emmanuel was probably like, look at that. See, he overhand bitch slapped him. This is crazy. He basically stepped in and palm striked him to the head.<\/p>\n
GABLE STEVESON: You think he looks, if he\u2019s still alive, you think he looks back at this video and be like, damn, I got slapped. Probably. Damn.<\/p>\n
JOE ROGAN: I mean, Emmanuel fought a bunch of different things. He fought, I think he fought in Pride as well.<\/p>\n
GABLE STEVESON: If I\u2019m\u2026<\/p>\n
JOE ROGAN: Oh, oh, they forgot to lock the cage. He flew out the cage. Look at thin, big John McCarthy.<\/p>\n
GABLE STEVESON: He lost. Mark Ryland. Mark Ryland of Iowa.<\/p>\n
JOE ROGAN: Okay, there you go. That\u2019s random, but we\u2019re talking about, yes. Yeah. The old days were wild, man. It\u2019s wild. It\u2019s wild to go back and watch those fights.<\/p>\n
Fear Factor Memories<\/p>\n
GABLE STEVESON: It\u2019s like, since you\u2019ve been kind of a huge figure your whole life, have you gone back and watch Fear Factor?<\/p>\n
JOE ROGAN: I watched it because my kids were watching it. My kids were watching Fear Factor because there was a whole Fear Factor channel. Was it True TV or one of those?<\/p>\n
GABLE STEVESON: One of those things.<\/p>\n
JOE ROGAN: They had Fear Factor on all day long, and my kids were watching it. They thought it was hilarious, man.<\/p>\n
GABLE STEVESON: I was watching it, too. I\u2019m just going to tell you right now. And all the sh*t they was doing. Hell, no.<\/p>\n
JOE ROGAN: Yeah. A lot of it is in your head. A lot of the stuff that they had to eat is not that bad. Some of it was f*ing disgusting.<\/p>\n
GABLE STEVESON: Were you trying some while they were trying?<\/p>\n
JOE ROGAN: I ate a bunch of things.<\/p>\n
GABLE STEVESON: What was the worst thing?<\/p>\n
JOE ROGAN: None of the things I ate were that bad. I ate a Madagascar hissing cockroach. It\u2019s a cockroach the size of this lighter.<\/p>\n
GABLE STEVESON: Damn. Yeah.<\/p>\n
JOE ROGAN: Yeah.<\/p>\n
GABLE STEVESON: That wasn\u2019t bad. It was just crunchy.<\/p>\n
JOE ROGAN: Yeah. This doesn\u2019t have much flavor to it.<\/p>\n
GABLE STEVESON: Yeah. What was the\u2026<\/p>\n
JOE ROGAN: More in your head than anything, I\u2019m sure.<\/p>\n
GABLE STEVESON: What was being on that show. What was the worst thing you saw someone tense up about?<\/p>\n
JOE ROGAN: The worst thing was what they had to eat. Watching people throw up. I watch people throw up every day. You know how the smell of throw up makes you want to throw up? That went away after a while.<\/p>\n
GABLE STEVESON: It was that bad.<\/p>\n
JOE ROGAN: Yeah. I saw people throw up every week. Every week I was watching four or five people throw up. This is totally normal to be around.<\/p>\n
GABLE STEVESON: You look like a candle for you.<\/p>\n
JOE ROGAN: Because they were throwing up in front of me, and I was telling them that they keep going. I\u2019m like, don\u2019t worry. You can keep going. You keep going. Don\u2019t put that in your head. This is a task just you. You want to win? Okay, you can do this. I can help you. I can talk you through this.<\/p>\n
But you just got to, just you. You are in control of your body. Force yourself to eat it, chew it, swallow it, get it down. Let\u2019s go. But that was the worst, is the eating sht. Holding your breath underwater was hard. There\u2019s a lot of things they had to do that was hard. It\u2019s a crazy fing show.<\/p>\n
GABLE STEVESON: There was one where they had to jump out a helicopter and swim and grab some while the helicopter propellers were blowing the water so they couldn\u2019t.<\/p>\n
JOE ROGAN: We did a few of the things like that. Yeah.<\/p>\n
GABLE STEVESON: Were you ever scared?<\/p>\n
The Bull Riding Episode<\/p>\n
JOE ROGAN: For some of them, I was worried when they had a ride bulls. That one scared the sh*t out of me because the stuntmen are animals. If you ever meet stuntmen, they are some of the bravest, toughest dudes alive.<\/p>\n
And the stunt guys had this attitude about the bull. They\u2019re like, oh, that\u2019s a stunt bull. That\u2019s a practice bull. And I go, does a f*ing bull know he\u2019s a practice bull? I bet he doesn\u2019t. I bet he didn\u2019t get that memo.<\/p>\n
GABLE STEVESON: He don\u2019t know that he\u2019s just a\u2026<\/p>\n
JOE ROGAN: Bull. That\u2019s a f*ing huge animal. And you\u2019re going to get a hundred pound lady to ride this huge animal. That\u2019s crazy.<\/p>\n
GABLE STEVESON: It\u2019s over with.<\/p>\n
JOE ROGAN: And they got launched and almost got kicked and we, they rolled the dice a lot and got lucky that no one got seriously injured, I think. And the bull one was the big one for me. I was like, you can\u2019t predict that.<\/p>\n
You can if you got a car stunt. You got to jump a car off a building into this big cushion. Okay, cool. You kind of know what\u2019s going to happen. You know, this is the thing. This could go wrong. And this is how we\u2019re going to prepare against it going wrong or prepare for it.<\/p>\n
But you can\u2019t prepare for a bull. There\u2019s not much you could do. If the bull decides to stomp this person, that person could die like that. That\u2019s a real possibility. Especially people that have no business riding bulls. Yeah, bull running is hard for bull riders. Bull riding is tough.<\/p>\n
GABLE STEVESON: It\u2019s crazy. And they got a good seven seconds on that bull. If they\u2019re great, if they\u2019re great. If they\u2019re great.<\/p>\n
JOE ROGAN: And when you\u2019re watching it, you\u2019re like, oh, my God. You watch the bull kicking and jumping up in the air.<\/p>\n
GABLE STEVESON: Crazy. I know. Their lower back kills after that.<\/p>\n
JOE ROGAN: Oh, we had one guy on Fear Factor who was a professional bull rider and his shoulder was so destroyed, he took his shirt off to show me he had scars all around his shoulders. My shoulder pops out all the time. It just will pop out of socket. He\u2019d go reach for something, his shoulder would pop out of socket. It was just destroyed. It was hanging on by a thread.<\/p>\n
GABLE STEVESON: Jeez, that\u2019s disgusting.<\/p>\n
JOE ROGAN: Ugh.<\/p>\n
GABLE STEVESON: How do you live like that, though?<\/p>\n
JOE ROGAN: I don\u2019t know, man. I guess you just deal with it. I guess you just, that\u2019s the price you pay for greatness.<\/p>\n
GABLE STEVESON: Got to pay something.<\/p>\n
JOE ROGAN: Yeah, well, they all pay. Every bull rider pays. You see those guys later in their career, they\u2019re all stiff because they got fused discs and fing messed up bolts in their back and sht.<\/p>\n
GABLE STEVESON: They\u2019re all f*ed up spines rubbing. Oh, yeah.<\/p>\n
JOE ROGAN: It\u2019s a terrible, messed up, terrible way to live.<\/p>\n
GABLE STEVESON: I can\u2019t believe that bull riding is a real thing.<\/p>\n
JOE ROGAN: I know, it\u2019s nuts.<\/p>\n
GABLE STEVESON: It\u2019s fascinating though, because you could really see guys go out there and be like, you\u2019re facing the devil.<\/p>\n
JOE ROGAN: Literally.<\/p>\n
GABLE STEVESON: The bull is going to win all the time.<\/p>\n
JOE ROGAN: Every time. Even if you can do is hang on for seven seconds. There\u2019s no goat who could just hang on the bull as long as possible. I\u2019ll hang on that bull for 30 minutes.<\/p>\n
GABLE STEVESON: He can get a bitch.<\/p>\n
JOE ROGAN: He\u2019s going to get you off. Everybody goes flying eventually. Everybody.<\/p>\n
GABLE STEVESON: Everybody. It\u2019s going to happen one way or another.<\/p>\n
JOE ROGAN: Yeah. There\u2019s no human being that could just stay on a bucking bull.<\/p>\n
GABLE STEVESON: No.<\/p>\n
JOE ROGAN: And just like, when I decide, I\u2019ll get off.<\/p>\n
GABLE STEVESON: Have you rode?<\/p>\n
JOE ROGAN: No.<\/p>\n
GABLE STEVESON: Okay. I haven\u2019t either.<\/p>\n
JOE ROGAN: F* that.<\/p>\n
GABLE STEVESON: I don\u2019t think black people do that.<\/p>\n
JOE ROGAN: I think there are. Is there a couple? Got to be.<\/p>\n
GABLE STEVESON: Oh, look at that dude right there. Bam.<\/p>\n
JOE ROGAN: Ezekiel Mitchell. Look at the size of that thing.<\/p>\n
GABLE STEVESON: I mean, look at his angle.<\/p>\n
JOE ROGAN: You know what I\u2019m saying? He is so.<\/p>\n
GABLE STEVESON: The bull is so athletic that he damn near doing a handspring.<\/p>\n
JOE ROGAN: Exactly.<\/p>\n
GABLE STEVESON: With the dude on his back.<\/p>\n
JOE ROGAN: Right? And he weighs 2,000 pounds. He\u2019s just throwing his body up and through the air. That is. F* all that.<\/p>\n
GABLE STEVESON: Like, right there.<\/p>\n
JOE ROGAN: Like, you easily get stomped to death right there.<\/p>\n
GABLE STEVESON: It\u2019s game over.<\/p>\n
JOE ROGAN: You fall wrong, he lands on your face. And that is a wrap. Your f*ing head is pulverized.<\/p>\n
GABLE STEVESON: I wonder what the size of that thing. Yeah. I wonder what the numbers are on, like, if a bull stomps, like, the velocity of and the mass of it, like, what is the generator force?<\/p>\n
JOE ROGAN: Oh, it\u2019s got to be insane. You guys have died.<\/p>\n
GABLE STEVESON: None that I know. Hopefully.<\/p>\n
JOE ROGAN: None that I know. But, I mean, there has to be, like, an enormous number of guys that have died bull riding.<\/p>\n
Extreme Sports and Calculated Risks<\/p>\n
GABLE STEVESON: What\u2019s the, what\u2019s like the, since, since, like, on a crazy topic, what is, what is like, the craziest thing outside of, like, me fighting taekwondo that you\u2019ve done that you\u2019re like, damn. Like, that shit felt good.<\/p>\n
JOE ROGAN: I never did anything other than I had three kickboxing fights, but other than fighting, that was the scariest shit that I ever did. Yeah. I mean, I\u2019ve never done it. I\u2019m not like a, you know, parachute. No.<\/p>\n
GABLE STEVESON: Okay.<\/p>\n
JOE ROGAN: I\u2019m not a bungee jumper. I mean, I\u2019ve done bungee jumping on vacation. I did zip lining. I was like, what am I doing? This is stupid. I don\u2019t like doing stuff like that. I don\u2019t like dumb risks.<\/p>\n
GABLE STEVESON: No. I\u2019m big. So I went on a zip lining one time. You know you got to jump off the thing, right? You got to jump off the platform. I thought I was going to fight Joe. I\u2019m kidding you not. That might have been my last day on earth if that, that line didn\u2019t hold me.<\/p>\n
JOE ROGAN: Right? Because what do you weigh, about 250, like 255.<\/p>\n
GABLE STEVESON: And it bounces and you\u2019re like, uh huh.<\/p>\n
JOE ROGAN: I was in Thailand and I went to do this thing. It was a bungee core thing. And they said I couldn\u2019t do it because I was only 200 pounds. And I was like, that\u2019s crazy. Like, what happens if you get a guy that lies about his weight?<\/p>\n
GABLE STEVESON: It\u2019s over with.<\/p>\n
JOE ROGAN: Yeah, because people lie about their f*ing weight all the time.<\/p>\n
GABLE STEVESON: I seen the ones where the guys, they got the squirrel suit on and they jump off the building or they jump off the rocks and they go down and they come up and sometimes they don\u2019t. Sometimes they don\u2019t come up.<\/p>\n
JOE ROGAN: My friend Andy did that jumping out of a f*ing plane.<\/p>\n
GABLE STEVESON: He made it.<\/p>\n
JOE ROGAN: Oh, yeah.<\/p>\n
GABLE STEVESON: Okay.<\/p>\n
JOE ROGAN: He held the world record at one point in time for the longest squirrel suit flight. What are they called? What do they call those things? Wingsuit.<\/p>\n
GABLE STEVESON: Wingsuit.<\/p>\n
JOE ROGAN: He held the record for it. It\u2019s ridiculous, but Andy\u2019s nuts. He\u2019s a Navy Seal.<\/p>\n
GABLE STEVESON: 18 miles.<\/p>\n
JOE ROGAN: 18 miles, one flight.<\/p>\n
GABLE STEVESON: What do you think he\u2019s thinking at like, mile nine? Maybe I drop.<\/p>\n
JOE ROGAN: He\u2019s a psycho. I don\u2019t know.<\/p>\n
GABLE STEVESON: 18 miles is crazy.<\/p>\n
JOE ROGAN: Yeah, that\u2019s crazy.<\/p>\n
GABLE STEVESON: I would never do nothing like that, ever.<\/p>\n
JOE ROGAN: No, I\u2019m not interested in parachuting. I\u2019m not interested in any of that.<\/p>\n
GABLE STEVESON: I might get on a wake boat and surf. That\u2019s about all.<\/p>\n
JOE ROGAN: You fall in the water. Not that big a deal. With a life jacket. Yeah.<\/p>\n
GABLE STEVESON: Yeah.<\/p>\n
JOE ROGAN: That sounds reasonable. It\u2019s a reasonable thrill.<\/p>\n
GABLE STEVESON: Falling up. Hey.<\/p>\n
JOE ROGAN: Falling up.<\/p>\n
GABLE STEVESON: The sky is crazy.<\/p>\n
JOE ROGAN: Falling, the sky is crazy. But at least falling out the sky, you, you have equipment. You check the equipment. You make sure you double check you\u2019ve done it before. It\u2019s done. You know when to do it. With a bull, there\u2019s no safeguards, you know, I mean, you have like some sort of a chest protector on some people. You have a helmet. You\u2019re not. There\u2019s no safeguards. He could land on your hip, you\u2019re never going to walk again.<\/p>\n
GABLE STEVESON: It\u2019s over with. F* that. It\u2019s game over. I couldn\u2019t. I can\u2019t fathom riding a bull. Yeah.<\/p>\n
JOE ROGAN: Doesn\u2019t Donald do it? Does Donald Cerrone? He rides bulls.<\/p>\n
GABLE STEVESON: He\u2019s got the name Cowboy. You better do something.<\/p>\n
JOE ROGAN: He\u2019s out of his f*ing mouth.<\/p>\n
GABLE STEVESON: You got to do something with the name Cowboy.<\/p>\n
JOE ROGAN: That\u2019s a dude that has a real adrenaline problem.<\/p>\n
GABLE STEVESON: He\u2019s got a. I mean, rightfully so. He looks crazy.<\/p>\n
JOE ROGAN: He\u2019s got a real adrenaline problem. He told the story about getting trapped in a water. He was diving and he got trapped in a cave. And the guy he was with panicked because his cords got tangled up and the water was cloudy and he couldn\u2019t figure out how to get out. That was one of the most. I knew he was okay because he was right here telling me the story. But it was one of the most terrifying stories anybody\u2019s ever told me. But that dude loves that kind of shit. He loves, like, thrills.<\/p>\n
GABLE STEVESON: I can\u2019t. I don\u2019t think I can get behind thrills. I can\u2019t. No, it\u2019s too much. And especially your heart be like, mm, Is today my day? And I can\u2019t be my day.<\/p>\n
First Fight Nerves and Mental Preparation<\/p>\n
JOE ROGAN: Was fighting for the first time. Was that, what was the difference in, the difference in the way it felt the first time you fought versus wrestling?<\/p>\n
GABLE STEVESON: My, when I, when I wrestle, I\u2019m not really nervous. I\u2019m more anxious to, like, perform and put on a good show. When I went out there for my first fight, my heart was beating on my chest because that pin drops and it\u2019s like, it\u2019s me or you. And I always had the mentality of, like, it\u2019s me or you. It\u2019s do or die. Today\u2019s not my day. You got to go.<\/p>\n
But that first time, you\u2019re like, I kid you not. My heart was like jumping. And John had it, like looking me in the eyes like, oh, you\u2019re good. Rely on what you know. We\u2019ve been here before. You\u2019ve done this before. There\u2019s 2,000 people here you\u2019ve wrestled in front of 20. Just think about it like that. And when I thought about it like that, my heart rate calmed down. You know, you kind of get, like, shaky a little bit. You kind of feel like your legs are not there.<\/p>\n
And that was kind of my first time fighting after that at dirty boxing, I wanted to kill that dude, which.<\/p>\n
JOE ROGAN: Is really crazy because you couldn\u2019t even rely really on your wrestling in that.<\/p>\n
GABLE STEVESON: Which is what I wanted. Right. I wanted to. I wanted to go out there and show you that, that I can throw punches without having to look down at that leg. And that\u2019s exactly what we did.<\/p>\n
JOE ROGAN: Was that a calculated decision to try to do that as well as just like, to just have a pure striking fight just, just so you could show that you could do it and then in your own mind, not have your, your main skill set to rely on?<\/p>\n
GABLE STEVESON: Yes. I really wanted to handicap myself because I wanted to show the people to. And I, and I kind of, hopefully, I did show him a great show, and I was.<\/p>\n
JOE ROGAN: Oh, you definitely did.<\/p>\n
GABLE STEVESON: I want to show the people. I want to show the people at home that are a casual viewer that, who doesn\u2019t know Gable, like, hey, can I turn on dirty boxing? And the mom and dad and kids are sitting there watching saying, hey, what is about Gable Steveson that\u2019s special? And he\u2019s a wrestler, so what can be special besides wrestling? And then I go out there and I get this knockout, and I jump over the ring, and I was, and I\u2019m doing the Arthur Jones sack dance.<\/p>\n
The Viral Knockout Celebration<\/p>\n
JOE ROGAN: The crazy thing was the way you leapt over the ring like it was nothing. That was banana. What does it feel like to not have. Oh, there it is. Boom. But this is the, the nuttiest part right here.<\/p>\n
GABLE STEVESON: The big jump.<\/p>\n
JOE ROGAN: Like, it was nothing. That is, that is crazy athleticism. But it\u2019s.<\/p>\n
GABLE STEVESON: It\u2019s.<\/p>\n
JOE ROGAN: What\u2019s wild about that is you look like a, like a really good boxer, and you have only been boxing for a very small amount of time. Just.<\/p>\n
GABLE STEVESON: I just, I always had very good confidence in myself. I\u2019ve always spoke about myself highly. I\u2019ve always, like, wanted to be over the top, you know, like, like a WWE, you know, when he gets on the microphone to John Cena\u2019s.<\/p>\n
JOE ROGAN: Like, \u201cyou can\u2019t see me.\u201d<\/p>\n
GABLE STEVESON: Or Roman Reigns, like, \u201cacknowledge me,\u201d you know, when I go out there, I don\u2019t want to have to say those things I wanted to. When you see me, that\u2019s him. And I\u2019ve always tried to be, that\u2019s the bigger than Gable person. But also, like, if we had, like, a routine convo, you can see, like, man, he\u2019s real human, you know, you can talk to him. He does real things. We put on the, we put on shoes the same way. We put on pants the same way.<\/p>\n
And I feel like a lot of superstars don\u2019t really show people that side of them, and it\u2019s up to them if they want to or they not. But I\u2019ve always really liked showing the families and the kids that, like, man, look at Gable, you know, he\u2019s a normal human being.<\/p>\n
JOE ROGAN: But when you compete, it\u2019s different. It\u2019s special, it\u2019s different. But it\u2019s just crazy to be able to do that in a sport that you\u2019re relatively new at.<\/p>\n
GABLE STEVESON: I mean, just, man, just think big about yourself.<\/p>\n
JOE ROGAN: I get it.<\/p>\n
GABLE STEVESON: I tell every kid. I tell everybody.<\/p>\n
JOE ROGAN: What\u2019s crazy about that, honestly, is, like, I know you\u2019re just going to get better at it. That\u2019s what\u2019s crazy. When you watch someone strike that well early in their striking career, like, your striking journey is so new that the sky\u2019s the limit. As far as your potential, Joe, in.<\/p>\n
The Worst Version of Himself<\/p>\n
GABLE STEVESON: The nicest way possible, I really want to say this. That\u2019s the worst I\u2019ll ever be. The worst I\u2019ll ever be, of course. And for whoever who\u2019s going to watch this, that\u2019s the worst I\u2019ll ever be. Just think about it. 14 seconds.<\/p>\n
And then now think about if you\u2019re going to put some time into me, some effort into me, and I\u2019m putting effort into myself, that dirty boxing is probably the weakest I\u2019ll ever be in the sport of MMA.<\/p>\n
JOE ROGAN: I believe you.<\/p>\n
GABLE STEVESON: I believe you.<\/p>\n
JOE ROGAN: I mean, it only makes sense if you\u2019ve been training that short amount of time in striking. Now, when you train striking, are you training boxing? Are you doing Muay Thai? What kind of striking training are you doing? Are you incorporating it all together in MMA?<\/p>\n
Training Regimen and Approach<\/p>\n
GABLE STEVESON: I do it all. So a lot of days I go in. So I kind of have a really good schedule right now since I\u2019m not going to go into a fight. So I do every day besides Sunday, some days are two a days, because I go to Lifetime and play basketball. I go to Lifetime and sit in the cold tub and sauna and stuff.<\/p>\n
But when I strike, I go in there. One round\u2019s maybe boxing. Next round is kicks, teeps, knees, everything, elbows. The next round is what the blueprint I have of what moves I need to really do to get in to kind of get to my shots or I\u2019m going to fake, shoot and punch, and then I probably go 10 rounds, 12 rounds of that, five minutes each.<\/p>\n
JOE ROGAN: So you always incorporate all the MMA skills together in a workout?<\/p>\n
GABLE STEVESON: I try to.<\/p>\n
JOE ROGAN: It\u2019s interesting when I was talking to Ilya Topuria, when he\u2019s particularly when he\u2019s not training for a fight, he doesn\u2019t do that. He is very rare in that. When he goes and he works on his boxing, he\u2019ll just box, he just boxes. When he works on his jujitsu, he just does jujitsu. When he works on his wrestling, he just does wrestling.<\/p>\n
Then he puts them all together with MMA training, but he spends an exorbitant amount of time on each individual skill by itself to really hone and tighten those things up, which is, it\u2019s an interesting choice. And obviously for him, it\u2019s worked out spectacularly.<\/p>\n
But there\u2019s no real, I guess if you want to be an elite soccer player, I\u2019m sure there\u2019s a program that they\u2019ve kind of devised, like, this is the very best way to become a good soccer player. They have coaches and they game plan, they know what to do with MMA. There\u2019s all these different approaches. Everyone. Alex Pereira\u2019s approach is different than Merab\u2019s approach, which will be different than your approach. Everybody\u2019s got a different thing.<\/p>\n
GABLE STEVESON: Yeah, it\u2019s just like you said, it depends the person, and it also depends the team that you have. I\u2019m just really big on, I\u2019m still very new, so I\u2019m really big on just trying to make sure I can absorb all the information possible.<\/p>\n
And kind of when I go into these fights, these first few fights kind of showcase what I can. And sadly, they have ended early. Not sadly, but in a good way. You know what I\u2019m saying? But just go out there and showcase who I am.<\/p>\n
And when I go train, I don\u2019t mind sitting in there all day. Sometimes me and John will practice for hours, just sitting there repeating, repeating. And then all of a sudden, we go on at 8 o\u2019clock, it\u2019s midnight.<\/p>\n
But I like that, though, because it makes me feel good. It makes me feel like there\u2019s someone invested in me that makes me feel like I\u2019m here for a purpose. And it makes me feel like this is what I\u2019m, there\u2019s someone out of the country, there\u2019s someone in Russia. When I\u2019m sleep, he\u2019s up, and I don\u2019t want that he\u2019s up working.<\/p>\n
So when I can get all the time possible, I\u2019m making sure I get all that time because I don\u2019t want that dude to show up one day and he\u2019s got a little inch on me and I just can\u2019t, I can\u2019t think about that happening.<\/p>\n
The Heavyweight Division<\/p>\n
JOE ROGAN: I always have that thought in my head in terms of UFC fighters. There\u2019s such a shallow division. The heavyweight division is so shallow. I\u2019m like, there is got to be some elite Russian wrestlers that are thinking about going the Fedor Emelianenko route.<\/p>\n
They\u2019re thinking about, I know Nemkov, who just won the PFL title. He\u2019s a very high level guy. But there has to be some really high level wrestlers that are considering going into MMA right now.<\/p>\n
GABLE STEVESON: Russian heavyweights are really not as good as people think in wrestling. Really. They got a guy named Abdur Shizat alive. I don\u2019t know if you\u2019ve heard of him.<\/p>\n
JOE ROGAN: I have. DC told me about him.<\/p>\n
GABLE STEVESON: Man, he is crazy. If he came to fighting, it\u2019s over with. Not for heavyweights, for the other groups, because he\u2019s got to go through me if he comes, if he comes heavyweight.<\/p>\n
But Iranians, heavyweights are really good. I think that\u2019s where the heavyweight field should start coming from is Iran. They got a lot of good, they got two good guys that are, one\u2019s my age, I\u2019m 25, and another one is, I think, 22. They battle for the Olympic spot every year, but the older one wins just by a little bit. The time is going to pass where that guy steps up and he\u2019s going to take the spot. So I would watch out for him.<\/p>\n
Wrestling Background in MMA<\/p>\n
JOE ROGAN: You know what\u2019s interesting with MMA is some guys have a background in wrestling and then they learn how to strike, and then they fall in love with striking, and then they hardly ever wrestle when they fight. You know, it\u2019s kind of weird.<\/p>\n
Josh Koscheck is a good example, who\u2019s a very good amateur wrestler. And then when he fought in MMA, very rarely wrestled, it was mostly striking. He could knock guys out standing. And I think guys kind of fall in love with that.<\/p>\n
And then there\u2019s also the amount of effort. It\u2019s so tiring to wrestle along with all the other things that sometimes guys just put that aside and they just decide to stand and bang with people.<\/p>\n
GABLE STEVESON: I really love wrestling. I grew up wrestling, and if I had a chance, I would love to go to the 2028 Olympics and win a gold medal. That\u2019s how much I still love wrestling, but right now, my path is MMA.<\/p>\n
And I knew the first couple of times that I would get those knockouts. You look at your hands, and it\u2019s like, Spider Man, you got superpowers. I got lightning in my hands. I would have never thought in my 25 years of life that I would go out there and I would left hook somebody and he would be out cold, and I would double leg and flip him. Who would have ever thought that would ever happen?<\/p>\n
And so you\u2019re right. You get obsessed with knocking people out. But I still think my base is wrestling. I just haven\u2019t used the best base yet. And that\u2019s just, I just want to show people that my best base doesn\u2019t need to be used, because the second best one is just as good as the first.<\/p>\n
JOE ROGAN: Well, and the second best one is getting better all the time. That\u2019s the thing. And again, I keep going back to this, but if you can get that good at wrestling, you can get that good at anything. It\u2019s just a matter of putting in the time and dedicating yourself to that thing.<\/p>\n
But it\u2019s the mindset that allows someone to become an Olympic gold medalist in wrestling. Boy, if that person, that\u2019s a scary person. That person decides to focus on whatever the f it is. Fing pickleball. Who gives a shit? They\u2019ll be elite at it. They just have to, you will put their mind on it.<\/p>\n
The Mental Game<\/p>\n
GABLE STEVESON: It\u2019s 100% a mindset thing. It ain\u2019t nothing else. You can have athletic ability. You can hard work all day. You can be so disciplined in the world, but if your mind doesn\u2019t think it. That\u2019s why I feel like that\u2019s why I beat a lot of people before I even walked out. I knew it. I just, you just got to know. And some people ship mindset. Some people just don\u2019t feel it. And you just got to feel it.<\/p>\n
JOE ROGAN: You know, it\u2019s like I was talking to a friend of mine. I don\u2019t want to mention any names because then you\u2019ll connect it to the fighter. But he said, \u201cMan, he goes, I don\u2019t want to f* with anybody anymore that needs a mental coach.\u201d And I said, \u201cReally? Why?\u201d He goes, \u201cIt\u2019s just like this. Just too much. He goes, I want to do, don\u2019t need that shit.\u201d<\/p>\n
GABLE STEVESON: You don\u2019t need it.<\/p>\n
JOE ROGAN: It\u2019s interesting because some guys do, and some guys, that mental coach takes them over the top, and then they find a way to win where, you know, maybe they\u2019d have mental hiccups in the past.<\/p>\n
But his mentality was I want a guy who has no problems. If I\u2019m going to coach a guy, I don\u2019t want a guy who\u2019s a head case. I want a guy who goes in there and already has this, \u201cI\u2019m going to f*ing dominate.\u201d And if I don\u2019t, I\u2019m going to learn why I didn\u2019t dominate and I\u2019m going to come back, I\u2019m going to get him next time.<\/p>\n
GABLE STEVESON: Yeah. And I feel like that\u2019s the person I am. I just want to go in there and dominate. And I also think that a lot of people kind of rely too much on a lot of outside things to kind of make them feel good about themselves to go out there and perform instead of just, just putting that switch on and just saying, \u201cHey, we here.\u201d<\/p>\n
JOE ROGAN: Outside things like what? What do you mean?<\/p>\n
GABLE STEVESON: Just, you know, mental coaches, you know, someone, you got to get someone else to be maybe a breath working coach, another coach, another coach. There\u2019s so many labels for coaches out there that you don\u2019t need.<\/p>\n
And when I was wrestling at Minnesota, I had Brandon Eggam, Luke Becker, who\u2019s the assistant and head coach, and Trevor Bramble. That\u2019s all I had. I didn\u2019t have nobody else because I didn\u2019t want anybody to interfere with the connection that we had.<\/p>\n
And I think when you get a great bond with somebody and then you bring in more people, the bonds get mixed up. People are paying attention to too many different things instead of practicing. Maybe I got to work on my mind. Instead of working on my mind, maybe I got to go do something else. Maybe I got to take care of something else.<\/p>\n
JOE ROGAN: So sort of like when you were talking about not watching video on your opponents because you\u2019re thinking about his double, how am I going to stop his double? Instead of thinking about what am I going to do?<\/p>\n
GABLE STEVESON: Yeah, I would rather be productive for the team instead of productive for eight different people. And maybe three of them don\u2019t care about you as much. You know, they\u2019re there just to get a little something from you.<\/p>\n
Training Locations and Philosophy<\/p>\n
JOE ROGAN: Where are you training now?<\/p>\n
GABLE STEVESON: Right now I\u2019m still in Minneapolis. I\u2019m having a baby girl this Sunday.<\/p>\n
JOE ROGAN: Oh, congratulations.<\/p>\n
GABLE STEVESON: This Sunday, my little girl\u2019s coming out. I appreciate it. She\u2019s going to pop out. My lady\u2019s going to hopefully get induced that day. If it comes early, it comes early. So that\u2019ll be really nice.<\/p>\n
So I\u2019m in Minneapolis right now, but when I do all the main training, New Mexico. Jackson Wink.<\/p>\n
JOE ROGAN: Okay, so in Minneapolis, where are you training?<\/p>\n
GABLE STEVESON: That guy? With that guy, Billy Simon, a priority.<\/p>\n
JOE ROGAN: Same guy, really?<\/p>\n
GABLE STEVESON: I\u2019ve been with him forever.<\/p>\n
JOE ROGAN: So you\u2019re in this little tiny gym.<\/p>\n
GABLE STEVESON: I\u2019m in that little gym. Nobody sees us. We got partners that need to come in, but rather than that, I don\u2019t want the big lights.<\/p>\n
When I was growing up in Portage, Indiana, I had a wrestling mat in the garage and me and my two brothers would wrestle, and that\u2019s where we got the most work in. My dad said, \u201cGo in there and hand fight, and whoever comes out comes out.\u201d And it was definitely not me at the time, but maybe right now it\u2019s me.<\/p>\n
But we would go in there and hand fighting, if you get, my dad\u2019s philosophy was we had Iowa style wrestling, and Iowa style wrestling was brutal. If his face needs to be run into the wall, run his face into the wall. And that\u2019s how we grew up. And if you don\u2019t want your face ran into the wall, you better put his in first.<\/p>\n
JOE ROGAN: And so when you train with this guy, are you training, are you training, I could get a call in a week to fight and I\u2019m ready to do that, or are you training just like developing skills constantly?<\/p>\n
Training Philosophy and Fight Preparation<\/p>\n
GABLE STEVESON: I just religiously train to develop skills constantly. I try not to never stop. I don\u2019t like stopping because I\u2019m kind of a, this is crazy, I\u2019m a thicker body, so if I sit for a little bit, I feel like I\u2019m getting fat and I want to feel that way. So I just try to always keep myself in shape and try to keep the best look possible.<\/p>\n
So if you need me on one week, which I don\u2019t want to do any short notice, just how me and John do it. No short notice. Like, if you need me in a week, I look good, I\u2019m ready, but we just take our time.<\/p>\n
JOE ROGAN: So John coach you about that? Like, give you some thoughts about that? Because I think that\u2019s a giant mistake that guys make. And like, the Alexander Volkanovsky fight is a good example. The Islam Makhachev fight, he took that fight on 11 days notice. He\u2019s just been hanging around, drinking, partying, just being himself, just chilling. And then he also gets this opportunity for a rematch. First fight was razor thin decision. He lost. And he\u2019s like, I can do better, but you can\u2019t do better without a camp.<\/p>\n
GABLE STEVESON: You got to have time to be yourself.<\/p>\n
JOE ROGAN: Yeah, you have to have time to peak. And one of the things I really always admired about John is like, even a fight like the Chael Sonnen fight, they offered him, Chael Sonnen on short notice, he was like, nope, nope. And they were like, what do you, we need you to do this? He\u2019s like, nope. I\u2019m a professional world champion. I prepare for my opponents and I don\u2019t want to fight unless I\u2019m prepared for my opponent, period.<\/p>\n
GABLE STEVESON: It\u2019s the smartest way.<\/p>\n
JOE ROGAN: Look at him, he\u2019s the GOAT. I mean, it\u2019s just so many guys, they get, and I do appreciate that Alex does take those short notice fights and he wins some of those short notice fights, but how many times he\u2019s fought injured? Like really injured. Like the first Yuri Prochazka fight, he had a fed up knee, man. And when he stopped Yuri, there\u2019s a moment when he\u2019s on top of Yuri and he\u2019s beating on him and the referee stops it and he goes to step up and he rolls off of him. The reason he rolled off him, he couldn\u2019t support himself on his knee. That\u2019s how fed up his knee was. And he was in a world title fight.<\/p>\n
GABLE STEVESON: It\u2019s bad.<\/p>\n
JOE ROGAN: Crazy.<\/p>\n
GABLE STEVESON: Well, I feel like this is the only sport where they will let that happen. Just because football you sitting on, you sit on IR.<\/p>\n
JOE ROGAN: Yeah.<\/p>\n
GABLE STEVESON: We don\u2019t have no IR. Right. It\u2019s either you do it or you say no.<\/p>\n
JOE ROGAN: Right. And if you say no, they get upset at you.<\/p>\n
GABLE STEVESON: A lot of people get timid. Yeah. And I mean, once you get past that barrier of, I think right now, since I\u2019m going to have this daughter, I think my tone and mindset has changed to kind of really be more of a father figure for her, but also for, like, if kids want to look at me and be like, wow, Gable\u2019s normal also.<\/p>\n
But I think just you got to say no to a lot of people. You got to be generous in a lot of ways, but you also got to be able to go out there and say, I don\u2019t like this. I don\u2019t feel this way about this. And this is why. And be cool on both sides. But some people get scared about that moment.<\/p>\n
Strength and Conditioning Regimen<\/p>\n
JOE ROGAN: Are you doing, what kind of strength and conditioning are you doing?<\/p>\n
GABLE STEVESON: So I still lift with the college team, so everything they do with wrestling.<\/p>\n
JOE ROGAN: College wrestling team, yes.<\/p>\n
GABLE STEVESON: Everything they do at the University of Minnesota, I still do. I still got the same strength coach with them. Bike sprints, Aerodyne sprints, Watt Bike, versa, climbers, everything. We try to mix it in all rowers, everything, just to stay active. And if it\u2019s not where we\u2019re getting close to a fight, just maybe just take longer breaks in between just to keep the heart rate up. But I don\u2019t like when my heart rate takes a break. I like to kind of keep it consistent so when I ramp up, it\u2019s already ready to rock and roll.<\/p>\n
JOE ROGAN: You already have a very high baseline. Yeah. And like, when you\u2019re doing strength and conditioning, as far as, like, weightlifting and stuff like that, like, are you trying to put on weight at all?<\/p>\n
GABLE STEVESON: No.<\/p>\n
JOE ROGAN: You like 250?<\/p>\n
GABLE STEVESON: I like to stay where I\u2019m at. I do a lot of band work, a lot of explosive work, a lot of jumps, a lot of light weights with high reps, just to kind of keep the body moving and kind of keep the cutness and the strength there, but not also put too much.<\/p>\n
JOE ROGAN: Where you\u2019re stiff and you\u2019re naturally a large guy anyway. It\u2019s not like you have to put on a ton of weight. But, like, when you see a guy like Francis, who\u2019s 265 natural, and he used to have to cut a little bit of weight to make 260, which is kind of crazy, isn\u2019t it? Isn\u2019t it crazy? But it\u2019s also crazy that the UFC has a weight limit that you have to make at heavyweight. You have to cut weight to make heavyweight. How different you think it would be.<\/p>\n
GABLE STEVESON: If they didn\u2019t have 265 and it was just maybe 300?<\/p>\n
JOE ROGAN: It should be no weight. It\u2019s heavyweight.<\/p>\n
GABLE STEVESON: It should be.<\/p>\n
JOE ROGAN: What they really need is more weight classes, the UFC. There\u2019s gaps that are just enormous. Like the gap between 85 and 205 is crazy. 20 pound weight gap in between categories is, that doesn\u2019t make any sense to me. 10 pounds. 10 pounds is still a lot, but at least it\u2019s reasonable.<\/p>\n
GABLE STEVESON: How many weight classes boxing have? Like 30.<\/p>\n
JOE ROGAN: A shitload. They have so many. Boxing has so many weight classes.<\/p>\n
GABLE STEVESON: Boxing got like eight champions for each weight, too.<\/p>\n
The Value of the UFC Championship<\/p>\n
JOE ROGAN: That\u2019s a problem. That\u2019s a problem. MMA does as well, right. If you think about it, there\u2019s the one champion, there\u2019s the PFL champion. But the difference is really only the UFC champion in terms of the public perception. Like we talked about Nemkov, who\u2019s an excellent fighter, nobody knows who the f* he is. Not in America. You go to a regular kid, some kid on the street, and you say, who is Vadim Nemkov? And they\u2019re like, what?<\/p>\n
GABLE STEVESON: But I bet you that kid knows IShowSpeed.<\/p>\n
JOE ROGAN: I bet they do, right? I bet they do, right? They know IShowSpeed. They probably know who Alex Pereira is. They probably know who Islam Makhachev is. They know who the UFC guys are. The UFC, that title is worth so much. It\u2019s the name. It is the Combat Sports Leader. And if you\u2019re not in the UFC, I don\u2019t care. I mean, look, you can go to the PFL and you can win that million dollar tournament and you can make money, and I\u2019m all for that, and I\u2019m very happy for those guys. They get to feed their family and they provide and they make a great living and they can retire with some money in the bank.<\/p>\n
But the reality is, part of what you\u2019re doing is you\u2019re trying to be the best. And if you\u2019re going to be the best, you kind of have to be in the UFC.<\/p>\n
GABLE STEVESON: Agreed.<\/p>\n
JOE ROGAN: I mean, that\u2019s just what it is.<\/p>\n
GABLE STEVESON: There\u2019s so many great leagues, but like the most prestigious people. You can say PFL, you can say anything, and you can go to any place and make a s* ton of money, but once you get that stamp of he\u2019s a UFC champ, you\u2019re like, damn, man, that\u2019s him.<\/p>\n
JOE ROGAN: That\u2019s it.<\/p>\n
GABLE STEVESON: That\u2019s him.<\/p>\n
JOE ROGAN: Yeah, that\u2019s it. They put that UFC belt on you and it\u2019s on ESPN and everybody sees it. That\u2019s it. The PFL is just another belt. It\u2019s like, boxing has, so they have the IBF, the WBA, the WBO, the WBC. It\u2019s like, it\u2019s just like so many f*ing organizations, it just gets so crazy. It\u2019s like, then they try to make.<\/p>\n
GABLE STEVESON: Terence Crawford pay for his belt.<\/p>\n
JOE ROGAN: Ridiculous.<\/p>\n
GABLE STEVESON: How crazy is that?<\/p>\n
JOE ROGAN: Terence Crawford\u2019s like, f* you, I\u2019m the champ.<\/p>\n
GABLE STEVESON: I just wanted 300,000.<\/p>\n
JOE ROGAN: Everybody saw it. Is that what they wanted from him, 300 grand?<\/p>\n
GABLE STEVESON: Can we get a look on this? Because I might be tripping, but I think they stripped him with like.<\/p>\n
JOE ROGAN: Percentage of purse, and I think it was like 3% of his, whatever he made. So it was.<\/p>\n
GABLE STEVESON: That\u2019s so nuts. That is so nuts. That is so nuts that they get paid that much. Just be a sanctioning body and what are they doing? They\u2019re not doing anything. Like, it doesn\u2019t mean anything.<\/p>\n
GABLE STEVESON: Well, they just get the best looking guy to maybe throw a belt on you.<\/p>\n
JOE ROGAN: That\u2019s about all.<\/p>\n
GABLE STEVESON: They don\u2019t really get nothing else.<\/p>\n
JOE ROGAN: You get nothing, you get a belt. But the, everybody knows he beat, beat the brakes off Canelo Alvarez. That\u2019s it.<\/p>\n
GABLE STEVESON: Man.<\/p>\n
JOE ROGAN: I love Canelo.<\/p>\n
GABLE STEVESON: He\u2019s the champion.<\/p>\n
JOE ROGAN: I love Canelo as well, but, I love what Terence did, because what Terence did was crazy. He goes all the way up from 47 to 68. He had one fight at 54, wins the title at 54, and then goes all the way up to 68. And everybody\u2019s like, Canelo\u2019s going to be too big. Canelo\u2019s going to be too big.<\/p>\n
GABLE STEVESON: No way.<\/p>\n
JOE ROGAN: No skill. His next skill is king.<\/p>\n
GABLE STEVESON: Yep. And, but I think 38. He\u2019s 38. He could do a couple more if you wanted to. I don\u2019t think he does, but he don\u2019t want to.<\/p>\n
JOE ROGAN: I think he\u2019s done, and I love it.<\/p>\n
GABLE STEVESON: I love that.<\/p>\n
JOE ROGAN: He\u2019s done 300,000 dethroned over $300,000 fee.<\/p>\n
GABLE STEVESON: Wow.<\/p>\n
JOE ROGAN: That\u2019s crazy.<\/p>\n
GABLE STEVESON: Do you think that\u2019s right?<\/p>\n
JOE ROGAN: No. No. Unpaid fees and brief reign is undisputed chairman. It doesn\u2019t matter. He\u2019s the fing champion. You can\u2019t take the guy\u2019s belt because he\u2019s not willing to give you money. F you.<\/p>\n
GABLE STEVESON: He won.<\/p>\n
JOE ROGAN: He won. F off. F off. He won.<\/p>\n
The Future of Boxing and Zuffa<\/p>\n
GABLE STEVESON: Well, now I see that. Is there going to be a new boxing promotion? Zephyr.<\/p>\n
JOE ROGAN: Zuffa.<\/p>\n
GABLE STEVESON: Sorry.<\/p>\n
JOE ROGAN: Yeah. So the UFC is doing something with the Saudis, and they are, I think they\u2019re launching their first event in January. I think they\u2019re launching their first event the night before the big UFC on Paramount event.<\/p>\n
GABLE STEVESON: So it\u2019ll be the 23rd?<\/p>\n
JOE ROGAN: Yes. I don\u2019t think they\u2019ve announced anything in terms of the card, who\u2019s going to be on it. I mean, that\u2019s not a lot of time. That\u2019s only not even a month from now. So I don\u2019t even understand how they\u2019re doing that. But they\u2019re probably going to do the same thing that Riyadh season\u2019s doing.<\/p>\n
GABLE STEVESON: Which is really smart. Riyadh season is great. I mean, it\u2019s putting guys into that next level category of, hey, you are.<\/p>\n
JOE ROGAN: A star, and Turki Al Sheikh is throwing crazy money.<\/p>\n
GABLE STEVESON: Rightfully deserve for a lot of these guys.<\/p>\n
JOE ROGAN: Oh, yeah, they deserve it. Oh, they definitely do. But it\u2019s, if you do that, you\u2019re going to get people to fight that would avoid each other ordinarily, and we\u2019ve seen that already. The Saudis have already been able to do that, get guys to fight. And you\u2019re going to put on the most exciting fights, you\u2019re going to put on the best matchups.<\/p>\n
And so I think the UFC is trying to do that same kind of model. And now that the Saudis own Ring magazine, so they have the Ring Magazine belt, which has always been the most prestigious belt. Like, there\u2019s always a bunch of different champions in different weight classes. But if you\u2019re a fan of Ring magazine, like I am, when you would get Ring magazine and they would have the ring champion, at Marvin Hagler, like, well, that\u2019s the f*ing champion.<\/p>\n
GABLE STEVESON: That\u2019s him.<\/p>\n
JOE ROGAN: Yeah, that\u2019s it. There might be a WBO guy out there, a WBA guy out there, but the reality is that\u2019s the guy. That\u2019s the guy. And boxing needs like a unified champion thing like that. So, like, when you see Terrence in there with five belts, like, it\u2019s great that he\u2019s got all those belts, but why? It should be one belt. Like, this is the super middleweight champion of the fing planet, period. F all your sanctioning bodies. That\u2019s the guy. That\u2019s it. One belt is all he needs.<\/p>\n
GABLE STEVESON: And they all different colors, too.<\/p>\n
JOE ROGAN: They\u2019re all cool looking. They\u2019re all cool looking. He\u2019s got them all. I mean, you go over his living room, it\u2019s probably dope.<\/p>\n
GABLE STEVESON: The Instagram picture look cool?<\/p>\n
JOE ROGAN: Yeah, it looks great. It looked great when he was in the ring and he\u2019s got them on his shoulders and one on his waist. And I wonder if they fight over who gets to be on the waist, you know, like, I\u2019ll give you an extra 100 grand if you put it on your waist, you know.<\/p>\n
But the reality is, it\u2019s like the belt doesn\u2019t mean anything. The fighter means something. And when we all know who the champ is, we all know it\u2019s Terrence. If this other guy gets the belt, like, okay, you didn\u2019t beat Terrence Crawford, so you\u2019re not really the 168 pound champion.<\/p>\n
GABLE STEVESON: But isn\u2019t that hard, do you think, for a boxer like that? Is that a hard shadow to live in? Or do you think it\u2019s a shadow? Or is that labeled as a shadow? You know, because Terrence leaves and then you step up.<\/p>\n
JOE ROGAN: Well, that\u2019s different. When Terrence leaves, if he gives up all the belts and he really does decide to totally leave, which I\u2019m not totally convinced because I think they wanted him to have a rematch with Canelo and I think he threw a big number at them. This is all, I\u2019m reading rumors online. I don\u2019t know what\u2019s, see if you find out what if that\u2019s true. Did they offer, did Terrence Crawford demand, like a certain amount for a Canelo Alvarez rematch? Because he\u2019s coming in soon. I\u2019ll ask him in person, but I feel like you could probably entice him for one more big fight.<\/p>\n
GABLE STEVESON: Probably could.<\/p>\n
JOE ROGAN: You know, one more big fight at 168 or maybe even at 154. I mean, really, he could fight at 147. I mean, when do you\u2026<\/p>\n
GABLE STEVESON: When do you think there comes a point where people need to just stop and like, you know, there\u2019s always going to be money thrown at you, but when you come up, when do you think there\u2019s a point that, like, it\u2019s\u2026<\/p>\n
JOE ROGAN: Different money person, you know?<\/p>\n
GABLE STEVESON: Yeah.<\/p>\n
JOE ROGAN: So here it is right here. So Bernie Davis revealed that Terrence Crawford\u2019s price for a Canelo rematch, and it\u2019s massive. According to Davis, Crawford won\u2019t return to the ring with Canelo Alvarez unless he\u2019s paid $100 million. And he deserves it.<\/p>\n
GABLE STEVESON: Rightfully so.<\/p>\n
JOE ROGAN: Crawford earned $50 million for the first fight in September. But after a tactical, low action bout that disappointed many fans. F off. Who the f did that disappoint? You got to be a casual if that disappointed you. Tactical, low action bout.<\/p>\n
GABLE STEVESON: Bleh.<\/p>\n
JOE ROGAN: Who wrote this? I don\u2019t know. F* off.<\/p>\n
GABLE STEVESON: I think I could write a better one than this.<\/p>\n
JOE ROGAN: I think boxing has some very disrespectful journalists. I see some disrespectful stuff they write about boxers. Go back to that little thing, what it said there. So, anyway, pressure now with Turki Al Sheikh to decide whether the rematch is worth that kind of money. Fans already calling for other opponents. Benavidez, Beterbiev, Bivol, fighters they believe bring real action. Oh, so this is kind of disrespectful.<\/p>\n
GABLE STEVESON: It\u2019s kind of messed up.<\/p>\n
JOE ROGAN: Real action.<\/p>\n
GABLE STEVESON: Why is she dissing? Why are they dissing them like this?<\/p>\n
JOE ROGAN: They do that a lot. There\u2019s a lot of talking in boxing, which I guess, fine. I like that there\u2019s not that much in MMA. MMA is much more respectful.<\/p>\n
GABLE STEVESON: Really. Standard and respectful.<\/p>\n
JOE ROGAN: Yeah. And that guy deserves everything. He\u2019s one of the greatest to ever do it and one of the best switch hitters in the history of the sport. Are you putting him above Floyd? It\u2019s hard. It\u2019s, you know, it\u2019s hard. You know, they never fought each other, which I think would have been amazing. If they\u2019re both in their prime at the same time, that would have been fantastic to watch.<\/p>\n
Floyd Mayweather vs. Mike Tyson<\/p>\n
GABLE STEVESON: Ain\u2019t Floyd supposed to fight Mike? Am I tripping? Yes, I think I\u2019m tripping. But I mean, I feel like that\u2019s going to be like Floyd versus, or, excuse me, like Mike versus Roy or like Mike versus Logan. It kind of looks more like sparring a little more like sparring really than a fight fight. How is Floyd going to fight Mike Tyson?<\/p>\n
JOE ROGAN: Have you ever spoke to Mike Tyson?<\/p>\n
GABLE STEVESON: Yeah, I\u2019ve had him on a couple times.<\/p>\n
JOE ROGAN: Yeah. He\u2019s my favorite.<\/p>\n
GABLE STEVESON: He\u2019s my favorite bro.<\/p>\n
JOE ROGAN: He\u2019s, when he was in his prime, there was nobody like him. There was nobody like him because he had that speed. That speed. And that\u2019s something that you have. The speed of a head of a lighter person in the frame of a heavyweight is an extraordinary gift. Because so many of these heavyweights, man, they got big power, but like Francis big power, but they don\u2019t move like a lightweight guy. They don\u2019t move like 170 pound guy.<\/p>\n
When Mike was in his prime, he was so fast, you could see guys trying to calculate and calibrate because it was different. They were used to fighting heavyweights. And all sudden you got this guy bobbing and weaving and moving towards you and like, ah, it\u2019s crazy. Your brain is being overloaded with all the possibilities. It was just, it was a totally different thing.<\/p>\n
GABLE STEVESON: He\u2019s by far my favorite.<\/p>\n
JOE ROGAN: Oh, yeah. In his prime, he\u2019s the most extraordinary heavyweight that ever existed because, and it was, every show was an execution. It wasn\u2019t like, you know, oh my God, is Mike going to lose this one? No. In his prime it was just all executions.<\/p>\n
GABLE STEVESON: And I think the best thing about that, like being popular back in the day, like, he was such a big time fighter. I was watching a lot of videos, like Will Smith and Magic Johnson were showing up and Jordan and stuff. How crazy it is nowadays that we have social media that you don\u2019t have to go and watch someone live. But back then, like when you see the videos of Michael Jackson and this hotel and you look out and it\u2019s like, wow. It\u2019s Michael Jackson. That wow factor is like super cool. And he had that.<\/p>\n
JOE ROGAN: Oh, yeah.<\/p>\n
GABLE STEVESON: To the highest degree.<\/p>\n
JOE ROGAN: Yeah. Everybody dressed up in the best clothes. They all showed up. Chains on, watches on, everything, everybody. It was an event to be seen at. And if you were one of the people that was ringside, like, you were, you know, you were an elite celebrity. And that was, you know, the Mike Tyson era. That was, I mean, it was different. It was different than, it was different than any other heavyweight, like, since Ali.<\/p>\n
So you had Ali and then Larry Holmes, who doesn\u2019t get the credit that he deserves.<\/p>\n
GABLE STEVESON: He was fantastic, too.<\/p>\n
JOE ROGAN: I watched all those videos, too. Amazing fighter. But he lived in the shadow of Ali, you know, and a lot of people hated him, too, because he beat up Ali when Ali was already done.<\/p>\n
GABLE STEVESON: Yeah, that was tough to watch.<\/p>\n
Larry Holmes and Muhammad Ali<\/p>\n
JOE ROGAN: And, you know, he had been Ali\u2019s sparring partner when Ali was younger, you know, and so, and everybody knew how good Larry Holmes was, and everybody knew that Muhammad Ali was older. And what\u2019s that?<\/p>\n
GABLE STEVESON: Would you do that if he was a sparring partner for your homie? And that\u2019s got to be a difficult combo because you burn, you burn a bridge.<\/p>\n
JOE ROGAN: Yeah, you burn a bridge with the whole society. But part of it is, like, you kind of have to, right? Because if you are the heavyweight champion of the world and they want to set up a fight with Muhammad Ali, Muhammad Ali wants to fight you, and they want to give you $10 million, and it\u2019s going to be on TV and everybody\u2019s hyped up about it, like, what are you going to do? Say, no, I won\u2019t fight him. I\u2019m going to relinquish my crown? What are you going to do?<\/p>\n
Like, I don\u2019t know if he had any opportunity to do anything other than fight him, but it\u2019s just like he was, Muhammad Ali was so beloved, not just as one of the greatest fighters of all time, but also as a cultural figure that watching that man beat him up like that, just beat the stuff out of Ali. And then seeing Ali afterwards when he had the shakes and he had Parkinson\u2019s, and everybody knew that that was trauma related Parkinson\u2019s. And knowing that Larry Holmes dished out a lot of that, I think in a lot of people\u2019s mind that sort, and I think that to this day is why Larry Holmes does not get the credit that he deserves. He had one of the greatest jabs in the history of the sport.<\/p>\n
GABLE STEVESON: Crazy. I just saw a video. He was flicking it.<\/p>\n
JOE ROGAN: Oh. Even when he fought Mike. When he fought Mike, he was way past his prime. You know, he had been out for a long time.<\/p>\n
GABLE STEVESON: Mike did his thing.<\/p>\n
JOE ROGAN: But you know, there was a round in that fight where Larry Holmes was popping that jab, where it made you think, like, man, what would this fight have been like if Larry was in his prime? You know, it would have been very interesting, I think. I think Mike was on another level, though.<\/p>\n
GABLE STEVESON: He was. He was. When I, when I see him, he just had the veins, you know, like, that was, that\u2019s my, like, wow for people. He was just\u2026<\/p>\n
JOE ROGAN: He was a speedy tank and just the skill, too. And also that style, that peekaboo style was just so different than anything else anybody was doing. So it was so hard to prepare for. You got most, most of these heavyweight boxers were standing straight up. You know, they throwing jabs and moving, moving like Foreman or moving like Ken Norton or whoever they were. But Muhammad Ali, you know, was the only guy that moved like a lighter guy.<\/p>\n
GABLE STEVESON: He was.<\/p>\n
JOE ROGAN: He was different. But Mike Tyson was crouching and bobbing and weaving and coming at you. It was a totally different thing to prepare for.<\/p>\n
GABLE STEVESON: You can\u2019t prepare for something like that. That\u2019s like, when someone is too athletic, that\u2019s like preparing for Myles Garrett right now. You just can\u2019t. He\u2019s going to have 25 sacks this year. And it\u2019s like, how do you prepare for something like that besides try to psych yourself into, maybe I can do it, but this is not going to happen.<\/p>\n
Athletic Freaks and Training Evolution<\/p>\n
JOE ROGAN: There\u2019s always going to be freaks. There\u2019s always going to be these athletic freaks that can just do things that no one else can do.<\/p>\n
GABLE STEVESON: Now there\u2019s more than now. There\u2019s even more. Because you see high school football, guys, 6\u20195\u2033, 281 at Ohio State, I\u2019m like, damn, what they got. People are bigger.<\/p>\n
JOE ROGAN: Also, people are doing things for their kids at an early age to optimize their growth and making sure that they come out bigger and stronger and faster, getting them training younger, strength and conditioning and plyometrics and stuff when they\u2019re real young to get them prepared for things. I mean, look, you know Vasyl Lomachenko.<\/p>\n
GABLE STEVESON: Yes. So that\u2019s fast.<\/p>\n
JOE ROGAN: That dude\u2019s dad took him out of boxing for two years to have him learn Ukrainian dance so that he\u2019d have better footwork.<\/p>\n
GABLE STEVESON: And he was dancing on people. I see, I watched his highlights on Instagram.<\/p>\n
JOE ROGAN: Footwork was insane.<\/p>\n
GABLE STEVESON: Usyk\u2019s the same.<\/p>\n
JOE ROGAN: Same coach.<\/p>\n
GABLE STEVESON: Usyk\u2019s the same person, same coach. I really like Usyk.<\/p>\n
JOE ROGAN: Yeah. Oh, my God. Usyk\u2019s crazy again. One of the greatest heavyweights of all time. And not a big guy either. You know, he just knows where to\u2026<\/p>\n
GABLE STEVESON: Go and when to go. Which is nice.<\/p>\n
The Art of Movement and Striking<\/p>\n
JOE ROGAN: What\u2019s also, he\u2019s constantly moving. He\u2019s never right in front of you. He\u2019s constantly stepping, stepping and stepping and stuff. And he\u2019s setting you up and he\u2019s always downloading and calculating your movements and your reactions to things. It\u2019s so skillful.<\/p>\n
That, to me is the most beautiful thing about boxing, is that someone could stand in the fire and be so skillful that, like Crawford, that, I mean, standing right in front of Canelo, there was one point in the fight where he was pity patting him. Here\u2019s Lomachenko when he\u2019s in his prime. The movement was bananas and it was just his ease of footwork. And it wasn\u2019t footwork like trying to get away from you. It was footwork standing right in front of you and stepping off to the side and cracking.<\/p>\n
That kind of shit. These angles is just, unless you have tried to do that, you don\u2019t know how ridiculously difficult that is.<\/p>\n
GABLE STEVESON: The conditioning on that is crazy.<\/p>\n
JOE ROGAN: Oh, yeah. Your legs have to be in peak form. Super peak form. It\u2019s just there\u2019s so many guys out there that you could learn from by watching. And they set the bar so high. And that is the difference between watching, like Keith Hackney versus Emmanuel Yarborough way back in 1993 versus watching Jon Jones in 2025.<\/p>\n
It\u2019s like we get to see now these guys that seen it all, the Pyotr Yan\u2019s, the Ilia Toporia\u2019s, the Islam Makhachev\u2019s. You get to see the elite of the elite today. And these young kids that are coming up now, they get to see that and learn from that and incorporate all these things. And you\u2019re seeing these guys that are fighting on Dana White\u2019s Contender Series that are, they look like world championship caliber fighters and they\u2019re not even in the UFC yet.<\/p>\n
GABLE STEVESON: Most definitely the latter guys. Most definitely the latter guys.<\/p>\n
Revitalizing the Heavyweight Division<\/p>\n
JOE ROGAN: Yeah. There\u2019s so many good guys now, but in the heavyweight division, it\u2019s still fairly shallow. I know where Gable comes in.<\/p>\n
GABLE STEVESON: It\u2019s funny, I think I heard you say \u201cshallow\u201d about three times. And Joe, in the most nicest way, because I like to be, I like to be humble with the words and I like to talk with the confidence. I really think I can go out there and do right by this big promotion and go out there and just be fantastic.<\/p>\n
JOE ROGAN: I think you can too. And I think you can do what Mike Tyson did, which is revitalize the heavyweight division. Because, I mean, other than Jon, who\u2019s of course a superstar, but he\u2019s kind of semi-retired, the Tom Aspinall, Ciryl Gane thing was a fing disaster. And that\u2019s a disaster. I mean, Tom Aspinall still can\u2019t see. He\u2019s got a fed up right eyeball.<\/p>\n
GABLE STEVESON: Still really bad. Right.<\/p>\n
JOE ROGAN: I mean, the reality is he might not ever fight again. Who knows? If he has surgery on his eye and it doesn\u2019t go well and he can\u2019t see out of the eye, apparently he\u2019s still fed up in his right eye. There\u2019s some tendon damage or something. And eyes are so tricky. You never know, unless you\u2019re a fing complete psychopath like Michael Bisping, who fought 11 fights in the UFC blind in one eye, which is so crazy that he did that.<\/p>\n
Do you know what he did, that crazy motherf*er?<\/p>\n
GABLE STEVESON: What he do?<\/p>\n
The Michael Bisping Eye Chart Story<\/p>\n
JOE ROGAN: He memorized the eye chart. He memorized it so that he could, they could cover his left eye. Oh, my God. And he could just\u2026<\/p>\n
GABLE STEVESON: So whenever he went to do an eye exam, he knew the letters.<\/p>\n
JOE ROGAN: They would say, \u201cAll right, read the third chart\u201d and you would say, \u201cA, B, C, D, E.\u201d He knew what the letters were.<\/p>\n
GABLE STEVESON: Oh, he\u2019s smart.<\/p>\n
JOE ROGAN: He\u2019s crazy. He couldn\u2019t f*ing see out of one of his eyes and still fought world class fighters. I think 11 fights he had only being able to see out of one eye.<\/p>\n
GABLE STEVESON: Yeah. I\u2019m not really sure how to engage with the eye talk on Tom Aspinall, but I think he\u2019s a fantastic fighter. I think\u2026<\/p>\n
JOE ROGAN: What do you mean by \u201cengaged with the eye talk\u201d?<\/p>\n
GABLE STEVESON: I feel like getting poked in the eye sucks. And I just don\u2019t know how he feels that he got, you know what I\u2019m saying? So I\u2019m not going to\u2026<\/p>\n
JOE ROGAN: We don\u2019t know what he was experiencing during the fight. Yeah.<\/p>\n
Comparing Tom Aspinall to Olympic Competition<\/p>\n
GABLE STEVESON: And nobody ever, and nobody ever knows. But critics going to go online and say X, Y and Z, but I\u2019m just going to stand the middle ground. I say I think Tom\u2019s a fantastic fighter. Ciryl is great also, and I think a lot of them are also great also. You\u2019re going to always say it\u2019s really shallow, and I believe it\u2019s shallow too. And I believe I can go out there and do the best I can and really dominate when I need to.<\/p>\n
But just when I see Tom Aspinall, Tom Aspinall reminds me of a guy from Turkey that I wrestled in the Olympics. He was a 2016 Olympic champ. His name, Taha Akgul. He was six foot four, same size as Tom, same build, same everything. And I went out there and I beat him 8 to 0. And I was in his face for that six minutes and I let him know that I was here.<\/p>\n
And I feel like in that instance, that\u2019s when the tides change. And I feel like with a guy like Tom, I think I look at him as like a guy like Taha Akgul. He\u2019s on top, he\u2019s the leader. He\u2019s still fresh. But I think there\u2019s another hungry guy that\u2019s going to come and hopefully it\u2019s me that\u2019s going to come and go out there and do what I need to do.<\/p>\n
JOE ROGAN: Well, listen, I hope Tom gets back in because again, we don\u2019t know what\u2019s going on with his eye. And for all the critics need to know this, the right eye, that\u2019s the problem. But if you look at when he fought his left eye, the finger went deeper in his left eye than it did his right eye. So if you think he\u2019s faking it, he was knuckle deep in that f*ing left eye.<\/p>\n
GABLE STEVESON: He was all up in that eye.<\/p>\n
JOE ROGAN: Yeah, I mean, it\u2019s horrible to see, to undergo multiple eye surgeries, multiple eye surgeries, and that\u2019s horrible. \u201cBy the time a statement goes out, I\u2019ll probably have surgery on one eye already. Neck surgery is coming mid January.\u201d Neck surgery. So he\u2019s having surgery on both eyes.<\/p>\n
Post-Fight Reactions and Mindset<\/p>\n
GABLE STEVESON: It\u2019s really messed up, but I think the way the post fight interview went, because I like to look at how people approach the world also too. And he was just upset how the people were reacting, saying, \u201cWhy the f* are you booing? Why are you doing this?\u201d I mean, there could have been a, there could be a great approach to that of him saying, \u201cMan, I got my eye poked, but I\u2019m going to come back stronger from this.\u201d<\/p>\n
JOE ROGAN: Well, the problem is people are always going to doubt you when you get poked in the eye. There\u2019s always going to be a bunch of people like, \u201cOh, you\u2019re fine,\u201d because people have gotten poked in the eye and they have continued fighting. But is that smart? It\u2019s a foul.<\/p>\n
First of all, I think every time a guy gets poked in the eye, one point deduction immediately, instantly, maybe even two points. You should never do that to a person. Never. One thing you notice about Petr Yan\u2019s fight with Merab, he fights like this, his hand is in a fist. So when he\u2019s got his hand up like this and the front hand\u2019s extended, he\u2019s not doing that.<\/p>\n
GABLE STEVESON: He\u2019s kind of guiding you. Yeah, honestly.<\/p>\n
The Eye Poke Problem and Glove Design<\/p>\n
JOE ROGAN: Well, he\u2019s letting you know this motherf*er\u2019s coming. And he\u2019s also in a shell, very well protected by having that one hand up like that and have that shoulder. He\u2019s got the chin blocked, and then he\u2019s doing this with this hand. It\u2019s a very good defensive position. Also very skillful, because he\u2019s so good defensively in terms of his movement and the way he\u2019s able to roll with punches and get out of the way in time.<\/p>\n
But he never pokes in the eye. He\u2019s not doing that. Ciryl Gane has a habit of doing that.<\/p>\n
GABLE STEVESON: Why do you think that is?<\/p>\n
JOE ROGAN: You could speculate. You could speculate all day long. You could say he wants to do it. I mean, ask Jon. Jon\u2019s poked people in the eyes.<\/p>\n
GABLE STEVESON: He does it all the time.<\/p>\n
JOE ROGAN: Yeah.<\/p>\n
GABLE STEVESON: I mean, even if you would have took the points from him, he still would have won.<\/p>\n
JOE ROGAN: Yeah, I know. It\u2019s just, it\u2019s one of those things. It\u2019s like, here\u2019s a problem. Why are the fingers out in the first place? Why don\u2019t they cover that shit up? Why don\u2019t they have it like one of those Everlast bag gloves where it\u2019s like a mitt? Yeah, yeah. I mean, have the thumb out. Because you don\u2019t grapple with these anyway. You don\u2019t do this. You never do this.<\/p>\n
So why do the fingers have to be loose? If you grapple, you\u2019re grappling like this or like this. If you\u2019re clenching your hands together. You\u2019re never clenching your hands together like this. You never interlace your fingers together. So why the f* are they open in the first place when it only causes problems?<\/p>\n
If they developed an MMA glove that covered the tips of the fingers like a mitten, we would have way less problems with this shit. You\u2019d occasionally probably have a thumb in the eye every now and again, but you would have at least eight less possibilities each fight of things going into your eye.<\/p>\n
GABLE STEVESON: True.<\/p>\n
JOE ROGAN: It just makes sense. And it wouldn\u2019t hinder grappling. You just have a thin piece of leather that, the padding goes over the knuckles, the piece of leather goes over the tip of the fingers, and have it come down like this, like a mitten. But not hard to design.<\/p>\n
GABLE STEVESON: If it was a mitt and I\u2019m on top and I grab wrist control. Do you think the leather of the mitt sticks harder?<\/p>\n
JOE ROGAN: Probably, yeah. Probably aid grappling. It probably make fights better. It probably do stuff like, you\u2019d probably be able to get more takedowns, maybe. I don\u2019t know, man. Maybe when the leather gets wet, maybe it becomes slippery like a finger. We\u2019d have to find out, but at least we would have less eye pokes. And it\u2019s not going to hinder the striking at all. There\u2019s no need to have these fingers exposed like this.<\/p>\n
GABLE STEVESON: No, there\u2019s no need. But two great fighters, I mean, accidents happen.<\/p>\n
JOE ROGAN: Accidents happen. And also purposeful fouls happen. And I\u2019m not saying that Ciryl Gane did it on purpose, but he did it like five times in that fight. I rewatched that fight a couple of times, and every time Aspinall came towards him, he was doing this every time. Fingers outstretched, pointed towards the face.<\/p>\n
It\u2019s just, it\u2019s illegal. You\u2019re not supposed to ever do that. Your fist should always be balled up when it\u2019s moving towards your fight, your opponent\u2019s face. But we don\u2019t have to have these goddamn fingers covered like that or open like that. They should be covered. It\u2019s not impossible to do. It could be really easy to design a glove like that. I don\u2019t understand for the life of me how the sport\u2019s been around since 1993 and no one has introduced gloves like that. True.<\/p>\n
GABLE STEVESON: No, you\u2019re right. A really good thing I wanted to ask you is, for someone new coming in to a sport that a lot of people know, how do you think they should bridge the popularity of the sport and also the real life of who the person is? I might be saying this in a hard way.<\/p>\n
JOE ROGAN: No, I know what you\u2019re saying.<\/p>\n
Bridging Fame and Authenticity<\/p>\n
GABLE STEVESON: How do you think they should? Because I\u2019ve been around a lot of people, but it always gets bigger and always gets bigger. And how do you bridge that gap of keeping that same mind frame of, like, \u201cMan, I\u2019m the guy.\u201d But I need to reset. I always need a reset. I need to make sure\u2026<\/p>\n
The Pressures of Fame and Success<\/p>\n
JOE ROGAN: Yeah, well, it\u2019s going to be dependent upon you, right? And it\u2019s going to be a rocket ride that you\u2019re on. And the pressure and just the overall, like, not being able to go to the mall is going to be weird, you know, it\u2019s going to get weird. It\u2019ll get weird. You\u2019re going to get mobbed at the airport. It\u2019s going to get weird.<\/p>\n
And you\u2019re going to have to figure out a way to have your own private time. That\u2019s very important. When guys never have private time, they\u2019re always surrounded by people and they\u2019re always\u2014you could lose yourself, you could lose your way and just fame itself. Fame itself is very complicated. It\u2019s very complicated for people, especially for fighters.<\/p>\n
When your entire identity relies on the way other people perceive you, that\u2019s not good. It feels good when you\u2019re on top because everybody\u2019s like, \u201cOh, there\u2019s Gable. He\u2019s the fing man. Oh, you\u2019re the man. You\u2019re the man.\u201d But if you rely on other people\u2019s opinions of you for your self-esteem and your self-worth, then the moment you have a stumble\u2014what if you get eye poked? And then also, \u201cGable\u2019s a bitch. Gable, f.\u201d And you\u2019re like, \u201cWhat? What?\u201d<\/p>\n
And you\u2019re dealing with the opinions of morons, and they\u2019re affecting your own feelings about yourself. And then there\u2019s all the other pressures that come with money and people trying to scam you and business deals and bullshit and this and that, and they want you to do movies and that kind of shit.<\/p>\n
Look, that\u2019s the bane of fighters\u2019 existence. When Hollywood gets involved, that kind of, in a lot of ways, led to the decline of Ronda Rousey. In a lot of ways, Conor McGregor. People start f*ing throwing everything at you. You\u2019re doing cell phone commercials and all this different shit. And that stuff gets in the way.<\/p>\n
Yeah, it gets in the way of your training, but it also gets in the way of your ability to have that deep pressure time to be yourself and to be alone with your thoughts, which I think is very important just to solidify your own understanding of who you are as a human being. And you don\u2019t want to be defined by other people\u2019s opinions and perceptions.<\/p>\n
And then there\u2019s also like, the UFC does a fantastic job of showing who a fighter really is. The Countdown series, the UFC Embedded series. So when they\u2019re doing stuff like that, and you get to see this person interacting with their family, going through training camp, going through the weight cut, and you get to see who they are joking around with people, hanging out with their friends, laughing.<\/p>\n
That\u2019s important too, because people really want to relate to you. They don\u2019t want this guy who just appears every five months, you don\u2019t know shit about him. And then all of a sudden there he is in the ring again and you\u2019re putting all these things on him and imagining what he\u2019s like.<\/p>\n
The more they can get to see behind the curtain, the better it is for you. Especially if you\u2019re a good person and you\u2019re an interesting person and they get to see. It\u2019s also inspiring for people. They like you, like to talk about yourself like you\u2019re a regular guy. You put your shoes on one foot at a time like everybody else, but like, wow, look at the greatness this regular guy can accomplish.<\/p>\n
Maybe I can do this, maybe I can do something like that. Maybe in whatever I\u2019m doing in life, if I\u2019m a f*ing skier, whatever your job is, maybe I can be great and be a normal person. Like this guy is true?<\/p>\n
GABLE STEVESON: No, 100%. Well, that\u2019s a fantastic answer because I just feel like at some point I\u2019ll get to that spot. How do I know if someone\u2019s not real? How do I know if someone is in that space of things change and there\u2019s leeches, there\u2019s bad people. So it\u2019s always a nice thing to have someone that has surpassed that level that you can finally see and be like, man, how did you\u2014<\/p>\n
Jon Jones as Mentor<\/p>\n
JOE ROGAN: Well, Jon\u2019s a great guy to talk to about that. Obviously Jon\u2019s had his stumbles, which is\u2014when people talk about Jon and the things that Jon\u2019s got in trouble with, I\u2019m like, listen, you want a wild motherfer or not? Okay? If you want a guy to be the greatest of all time in fing cage fighting, he\u2019s going to be wild. That\u2019s one of the reasons why he\u2019s great.<\/p>\n
When Jon was\u2014what is he, 22 years old when he won the title?<\/p>\n
GABLE STEVESON: 23.<\/p>\n
JOE ROGAN: He\u2019s fighting 23, Mauricio Shogun Rua, who\u2019s an all-time great Pride legend. He opens the fight with a flying knee. Who does that? Who does\u2014you got to be wild. You got to be a wild fella. That\u2019s Jon.<\/p>\n
And obviously there\u2019s stuff he shouldn\u2019t have done. There\u2019s a lot of extracurricular activities, a lot of partying. It\u2019s not healthy, it\u2019s not good, but that is what comes with being that\u2014<\/p>\n
GABLE STEVESON: Kind of a guy.<\/p>\n
JOE ROGAN: And Jon could probably tell you more about this than anybody that\u2019s ever lived. Like, what were the stumbles? What could I have done differently? And he probably could help prepare you more than anybody ever.<\/p>\n
GABLE STEVESON: Most definitely. He\u2019s already kind of put a big foot into it and man, he\u2019s amazing with a lot of things now. He talks so well now. A lot of things are in a sense of\u2014he\u2019s trying to look out for me in business opportunities and places that I need to go. And it\u2019s amazing.<\/p>\n
A lot of people don\u2019t do that, especially when you see the peaks and valleys of that person and their public info also. And a lot of people don\u2019t want to give people the chance because you see something about someone until you finally meet them and it\u2019s like, man, this guy\u2019s a whole different person. You would have never expected.<\/p>\n
And so, man, with Jon, he\u2019s just opened a lot of doors and kind of he is doing that guiding of me.<\/p>\n
JOE ROGAN: Well, that\u2019s great too because Jon is essentially guiding his replacement, which is really hard for a lot of people to have that kind of self-awareness. Know that there\u2019s only a certain amount of time that I can do this for. And I see this young great man who\u2019s coming up and I\u2019m going to help him and I\u2019m going to give him some advice that maybe it would have been amazing if someone gave me.<\/p>\n
Because Jon didn\u2019t have some heavyweight champion training with him that could teach him those things. He\u2019s satisfied, especially not someone at that level, the level that he\u2019s at.<\/p>\n
GABLE STEVESON: Man, I know he\u2019s honored. We\u2019re both honored. Yeah, he just\u2014like I said, he called me today, he was just, \u201cMan, I really think you should just let the world know who you are and just kind of give people the real feel of who you need to be.\u201d<\/p>\n
And I\u2019ve always loved to have like you just talked about with the UFC Embeddeds\u2014you see the real human being and I\u2019ve always liked people seeing a real human being because we all do shit the same way.<\/p>\n
JOE ROGAN: There\u2019s nothing special.<\/p>\n
GABLE STEVESON: There\u2019s nothing special. Some people just have more money, some people just have more status. But at the end of the day, hopefully we can all sleep in a bed. And I know some people don\u2019t, which is sad to see, but it\u2019s just some people live different lives and I want to live a life where it\u2019s happy and healthy with the people I have and I can meet so many people and I feel like I\u2019m doing a great job right now.<\/p>\n
So man, any input I can get on how to be better, how to be more mature, how to be more sound, especially from Jon, I\u2019m getting a lot. But to hear from you\u2014you get different perspectives of you were in a different realm than Jon also. But you guys also in the same place. Like you do the podcast and Jon\u2019s semi-retired, but you see the two different lives of two different well-respected people.<\/p>\n
Protecting Your Focus and Excellence<\/p>\n
JOE ROGAN: Well, that mindset that you have to really want to acquire that information and really sort it out and know that these challenges are coming your way. The money and the fame and all that stuff is the thing that everybody focuses on, but really the focus is on excellence. Excellence is what brings you the money. Excellence is what brings you the fame.<\/p>\n
And the moment you start thinking about the fame and the money and not thinking about the excellence, you\u2019ve lost your way. You\u2019ve lost your way. And a lot of people lose their way. A lot of people, that money and that fame that it starts coming and all sudden you\u2019re just thinking about numbers, you\u2019re thinking about the house you\u2019re going to buy and the car you\u2019re going to drive and all that stupid shit and you lose your way.<\/p>\n
And one of the things that I always try to tell people, I try to see young comedians especially, is that think of the attention that you have. Like it has a number value. Like the attention\u2014imagine like if you had $100, you can only spend $100. Let\u2019s imagine your mind only has 100 units of focus. You have 100 units of focus.<\/p>\n
Any focus that you have on other shit outside of the thing that brings you excellence is just robbing from excellence. That\u2019s all it is. If you\u2019re concentrating on haters on social media, or if you got a crazy bitch in your life that\u2019s ruining everything, or you got some friend who\u2019s a hater and you think he\u2019s like maybe hoping you fail.<\/p>\n
All that stuff that\u2019s distracting and it\u2019s just robbing attention from excellence. And some of it\u2019s unavoidable and some of it actually strengthens your resolve to have a certain amount of shit in your life just to understand how to maintain and still be excellent despite of all that. There\u2019s probably some resilience building that comes from that.<\/p>\n
But protect your focus, it\u2019s precious. Protect your time, protect that energy that you have to invest in things. It\u2019s so precious. The mind, your focus and your drive. That is everything in your life. That\u2019s everything. And anything that steals from that.<\/p>\n
I remember this was one fighter, and he was a very good fighter that was fighting in Pride, and he had this crazy girlfriend. And every time he was going to fight, like the day before the fight, the girl would start problems and she would start fights, and she\u2019d screamed the hotel, like one o\u2019clock in the morning and went down to the bar.<\/p>\n
She wanted him to fail. She wanted to be more important than his fighting career. And his fighting career was so important and so overwhelming that she felt like she wasn\u2019t getting the attention that she needed. So she would go get attention from him and she would steal from him. It was crazy.<\/p>\n
And this guy, and he never wound up being a champion. He was a very talented guy, too. I don\u2019t want to say his name, but it was one of those things where it\u2019s like, man, there are people in your life, you got to recognize when you\u2019re dealing with that kind of a person, you got to cut them out. You got to get rid of them.<\/p>\n
They\u2019re stealing. They\u2019re stealing from your focus. They\u2019re stealing from your ability to create excellence. And that\u2019s what you\u2019re in the business of. You\u2019re in the business of excellence. And anybody that\u2019s trying to steal from that, like, those are liabilities there. That\u2019s like you got a hole in the bottom of your boat. You got to patch that shit up.<\/p>\n
GABLE STEVESON: Yeah. Well, it\u2019s just like Mike Tyson kind of said, \u201cOnce you\u2019re favored by God, you\u2019re also favored by the devil, too.\u201d<\/p>\n
JOE ROGAN: Oh, that\u2019s so true, too. Yeah. The temptations will come.<\/p>\n
GABLE STEVESON: Yeah.<\/p>\n
JOE ROGAN: And then also you start believing your own bullshit. I mean, look at Jon when he wasn\u2019t training. But luckily for Jon, he was so much better than everybody in the division that all it took was like a readjustment.<\/p>\n
Like the Dominick Reyes fight. He almost lost that fight. And Dominick Reyes, as great as he was that night, should not have been beating Jon Jones. I think Jon Jones with a real focus and a real drive towards destroying Dominick Reyes would be on another level.<\/p>\n
GABLE STEVESON: I think so, too.<\/p>\n
JOE ROGAN: It\u2019s like he could\u2014<\/p>\n
GABLE STEVESON: He could.<\/p>\n
JOE ROGAN: He is the best guy to be in your corner, man, because he\u2019s made all the mistakes and still come out the goat. Like, who better to tell you how to do it right.<\/p>\n
GABLE STEVESON: There\u2019s no one better, man. Probably the greatest. Of course, the greatest by far. Yeah.<\/p>\n
Downtime and Relaxation<\/p>\n
JOE ROGAN: What do you do for chill time? Like, what do you do to unwind?<\/p>\n
GABLE STEVESON: Honestly, right now, I like Call of Duty. I play a lot of Warzone Ronnie, 2K. You know who that is? The dude that made the basketball game.<\/p>\n
JOE ROGAN: Okay.<\/p>\n
GABLE STEVESON: So I got my own player on 2K, and it says my real name. When I load into the game, people know you\u2019re playing against me. So it\u2019s either I\u2019m playing Call of Duty or 2K. I mentioned before the French Bulldogs. I mean, I like to take care of French bulldogs. I feel like Jamie\u2019s got one.<\/p>\n
JOE ROGAN: You do?<\/p>\n
GABLE STEVESON: Yeah.<\/p>\n
JOE ROGAN: Oh, he\u2019s soaking today. We didn\u2019t know you were into French bulldogs.<\/p>\n
GABLE STEVESON: So I had, sadly, two pass away. I just had one pass away. He had IVDD in his neck. And that\u2019s a bad disc disease that happens in French bulldogs because they\u2019re bred so bad. So my first one had it in his back. He was playing all day, and then I turned, and he was paralyzed in an instant. And I was like, oh, man, that\u2019s not good. So I had to put him down.<\/p>\n
JOE ROGAN: Oh, that\u2019s horrible.<\/p>\n
GABLE STEVESON: And then I adopted one after. This is like, I adopted one a year ago. He just passed away a couple weeks ago. His name was Archie. My little guy, he had it in his neck. And I had him on painkillers for six months. And I looked, and one day he kind of rolled wrong and he kind of yelped again. And I was like, we got to take him in.<\/p>\n
JOE ROGAN: Oh, that\u2019s horrible.<\/p>\n
GABLE STEVESON: So it\u2019s bad. You know, I got bad attachments to French Bulldogs. They\u2019re like my, since I\u2019m having a real baby now, that\u2019s like my second baby.<\/p>\n
JOE ROGAN: You\u2019re going to be amazed how much you love your real baby more than you love your dogs. As much as I love my dogs, it just\u2026<\/p>\n
GABLE STEVESON: There\u2019s just another level.<\/p>\n
The Love of Dogs<\/p>\n
JOE ROGAN: Oh, it\u2019s beyond. It doesn\u2019t even compare. One of my dogs went to surgery today. He had a hernia. I have a golden retriever and a King Charles spaniel. He\u2019s the cutest little dog. He\u2019s so f*ing cute. He\u2019s seven months old, and he was born with a little hernia. It\u2019s like some of them get that little hernia, so they had to go stitch him up.<\/p>\n
But when I was playing with him last night, I was so scared. I was like, what if something happens to him? I can\u2019t take it, you know, because I love him so much. He\u2019s so sweet. He just, when I pick him up, he kisses me constantly. And he makes noise. And sometimes he barks while he\u2019s kissing you. And you\u2019re like, I love you, too.<\/p>\n
GABLE STEVESON: I love you, too.<\/p>\n
JOE ROGAN: And his little tail\u2019s wagging. He wags his tail. His whole body, his whole body\u2019s\u2026<\/p>\n
GABLE STEVESON: Wagging, wiggling all over.<\/p>\n
JOE ROGAN: Oh, yeah.<\/p>\n
GABLE STEVESON: Mine would go after the ears.<\/p>\n
JOE ROGAN: Yeah, he does.<\/p>\n
GABLE STEVESON: And he would nibble. Put a whole nibble on the ear and then he\u2019ll switch sides. And then he would switch sides.<\/p>\n
JOE ROGAN: Yeah.<\/p>\n
GABLE STEVESON: Let me live for a little bit. But I\u2019m his whole world, and I feel like sometimes we forget that.<\/p>\n
JOE ROGAN: Yeah, well, they\u2019re little love devices. They just want love from you and they want to give you love. They never have bad days, they\u2019re never shitty. They\u2019re never in a bad mood. They\u2019re always cool. You know, every day is the same thing. Every day I see him in the morning, like, good morning.<\/p>\n
GABLE STEVESON: He\u2019s so crazy.<\/p>\n
JOE ROGAN: And you just, I get on the ground with them.<\/p>\n
GABLE STEVESON: On the carpet and roll all over.<\/p>\n
JOE ROGAN: I love dogs. If it was up to me, I\u2019d have 50 dogs.<\/p>\n
GABLE STEVESON: I wish we could make them live longer. Making them live long would be crazy. Cats are like 20 years. Why can\u2019t a dog be 20 years?<\/p>\n
JOE ROGAN: Well, I think they are working on that. I think there\u2019s actual startups right now that are working on animal longevity. Yeah, they\u2019re working on different medical interventions that can allow dogs to live longer, which is fascinating. And then sometimes people, they clone their dogs.<\/p>\n
GABLE STEVESON: Tom Brady just did that.<\/p>\n
JOE ROGAN: Yeah.<\/p>\n
GABLE STEVESON: I don\u2019t know how he did it, but I mean, that\u2019s weird. Hey, have a good time.<\/p>\n
JOE ROGAN: That\u2019s Pet Sematary sh*t.<\/p>\n
GABLE STEVESON: That is. That might be hereditary.<\/p>\n
JOE ROGAN: Yeah, I don\u2019t know if I\u2019m into that.<\/p>\n
GABLE STEVESON: I don\u2019t know how I feel about that.<\/p>\n
JOE ROGAN: I feel like every dog has their own unique personality. And as much as I love the dogs that I have now, look, I had my dog Marshall, he\u2019s almost nine, or he just turned nine, rather. And I\u2019ve had him since he was a puppy. I love him to death. But then I got this new dog, Charlie, and I love him to death, too. He\u2019s a totally different personality.<\/p>\n
I don\u2019t mind new dogs and new personalities. I don\u2019t need the same dog over and over and over again. You know what I mean? I think that\u2019s weird. You should try French bulldog.<\/p>\n
GABLE STEVESON: They got 12 different personalities.<\/p>\n
JOE ROGAN: Oh, I love Carl. Jamie brings Carl in. He\u2019s a little psycho.<\/p>\n
GABLE STEVESON: He\u2019s got too many personalities.<\/p>\n
JOE ROGAN: Oh, he runs at you and just wants to play.<\/p>\n
GABLE STEVESON: They got that bowling ball head. I know.<\/p>\n
JOE ROGAN: He\u2019s a little ball muscle, too. Carl\u2019s jacked. Carl\u2019s got, he\u2019s built.<\/p>\n
GABLE STEVESON: I need to see a picture.<\/p>\n
JOE ROGAN: You got pictures of him? Pull up a picture of Carl. He\u2019s adorable. He plays at my golden, and he just throws himself like a meat missile at my golden, because my golden\u2019s so gentle, which is great because Charlie is only 15 pounds, my little dog. And so my golden is playing, and he gently puts a paw over him when they play. That\u2019s Carl. Look at that in the face.<\/p>\n
GABLE STEVESON: Look at that in a face. I just know he does everything extra. Oh, yeah. Oh, look at him sleep. He\u2019s really nice.<\/p>\n
JOE ROGAN: He\u2019s adorable. But when he plays with Marshall, it\u2019s really crazy. We got a video of him playing with him.<\/p>\n
GABLE STEVESON: Did you get his nose done? Nope.<\/p>\n
JOE ROGAN: No, he\u2019s just\u2026<\/p>\n
GABLE STEVESON: Wow, that\u2019s perfect. He had a good nose. That\u2019s really good.<\/p>\n
JOE ROGAN: Some of them have f*ed up noses.<\/p>\n
GABLE STEVESON: Well, they come out like this, and then they can\u2019t breathe, and so they breathe out their mouth. And sometimes they got to get it soldered. They clean that out. They make a bigger hole.<\/p>\n
JOE ROGAN: Awful.<\/p>\n
GABLE STEVESON: But some of them have it where you have to go in and kind of help the esophagus because their face is flat. So you got to help the back and kind of cut it to where it can go down the pipe.<\/p>\n
JOE ROGAN: Oh, no.<\/p>\n
GABLE STEVESON: Crazy. Crazy. I wish people, I wish those dogs could live forever. Those dogs got a million different characters.<\/p>\n
JOE ROGAN: I know. Well, I love all kinds of dogs, man. I love working dogs. I love German Shepherds and Belgian Malinois.<\/p>\n
GABLE STEVESON: Cane Corso. Be cool. They\u2019re a little dangerous, but that\u2019s what I\u2019m hearing. They only loyal to one person, if I\u2019m not mistaken.<\/p>\n
JOE ROGAN: They don\u2019t like to listen.<\/p>\n
GABLE STEVESON: Yeah, well, never mind.<\/p>\n
JOE ROGAN: My boy Mark, delegate from Sityodtong Muay Thai. He coached a lot of UFC fighters. Coach Kenny Florian, great Muay Thai coach. Great guy. Works for the UFC. He had a Cane Corso they had to put him down. Bit his hand. Chomped down on him. Yeah. And he had it for years out of nowhere.<\/p>\n
Well, you know, he\u2019s testing them. Sometimes those dogs, and not all of them, but some of them, they will test you. And you just can\u2019t have a dog that\u2019s biting you. No.<\/p>\n
GABLE STEVESON: Because what else?<\/p>\n
JOE ROGAN: Your kid. Yeah. What if it bites your wife?<\/p>\n
GABLE STEVESON: Yeah.<\/p>\n
JOE ROGAN: What if it bites the mailman?<\/p>\n
GABLE STEVESON: You never know.<\/p>\n
JOE ROGAN: Yeah. When it\u2019s just like those and it\u2019s not all of them. I\u2019ve had pit bulls and I never had a pit bull that even wanted to bite a person. They were always the sweetest with people. But then you hear stories.<\/p>\n
GABLE STEVESON: You hear stories, which is crazy. I know. Because how can I go online and see a pit bull just not letting go of somebody, but all of a sudden, the next video, I see a pit bull wearing a Christmas sweater with paw shoes on.<\/p>\n
JOE ROGAN: I know.<\/p>\n
GABLE STEVESON: So it\u2019s weird.<\/p>\n
JOE ROGAN: I know. It doesn\u2019t make any sense. It doesn\u2019t. But it\u2019s just like people. Some people are born crazy. Yeah.<\/p>\n
GABLE STEVESON: Some people are born crazy.<\/p>\n
JOE ROGAN: Yeah.<\/p>\n
Conspiracy Theories<\/p>\n
GABLE STEVESON: Are you big into anything? What do you believe in conspiracy wise? What\u2019s your big one?<\/p>\n
JOE ROGAN: Don\u2019t open up that door, Gable. Don\u2019t open up that door. Oh, my God.<\/p>\n
GABLE STEVESON: Yo, my dad. My dad\u2019s die hard conspiracy. If you and him had a talk.<\/p>\n
JOE ROGAN: Oh, what is his big one? What\u2019s the big one with him?<\/p>\n
GABLE STEVESON: I don\u2019t even know, but I know he\u2019s really bad. I think that the biggest one right now, he just said it, but I don\u2019t even know. I don\u2019t even want to say it wrong, but that\u2019s my thing. But I\u2019m big on conspiracy theory.<\/p>\n
JOE ROGAN: What is the subject? Do you remember the subject?<\/p>\n
GABLE STEVESON: Something about, I don\u2019t even want to say it.<\/p>\n
JOE ROGAN: Okay.<\/p>\n
GABLE STEVESON: I don\u2019t even want to say it right now. Okay.<\/p>\n
JOE ROGAN: We\u2019ll talk off air.<\/p>\n
GABLE STEVESON: Yeah.<\/p>\n
JOE ROGAN: Okay.<\/p>\n
GABLE STEVESON: But I believe there\u2019s a lot of things we don\u2019t know as people. And I believe there\u2019s a lot of\u2026<\/p>\n
JOE ROGAN: A lot of conspiracies are real. That\u2019s the problem. The problem with conspiracy theories is some of them are crazy and ridiculous. But the reason why people entertain crazy and ridiculous ones is because some of them are real. And they\u2019re so nuts that you go, they did what?<\/p>\n
When you just, when you find out about US history alone, you know, you find out that the reason why we got into Vietnam was\u2026<\/p>\n
GABLE STEVESON: I don\u2019t know this. Who got it?<\/p>\n
JOE ROGAN: Okay. It\u2019s called the Gulf of Tonkin Incident. The Gulf of Tonkin incident was supposedly the North Vietnamese, the Viet Cong, attacked one of our ships, but it was fake. They faked it. It\u2019s not real. It\u2019s called a false flag. And they did it just to have a story so that we would have an excuse to invade Vietnam.<\/p>\n
GABLE STEVESON: So we sent all those people to Vietnam for nothing.<\/p>\n
JOE ROGAN: A lot of people died for nothing. A lot of people died for nothing. And a lot of people made a lot of f*ing money. And it probably had to do with drugs, too, because they were moving heroin out of Vietnam. I mean, there was, it was, control of the heroin trade was a big part of it.<\/p>\n
That was also why one of the reasons why we were in Afghanistan. While we were in Afghanistan, heroin production in Afghanistan was 94% of the world\u2019s heroin.<\/p>\n
GABLE STEVESON: What does\u2026<\/p>\n
JOE ROGAN: And it ramped up after we invaded Afghanistan. It went up. Heroin production. Not only did it go up, but we were guarding poppy fields for the Taliban.<\/p>\n
GABLE STEVESON: Why do we need to guard for the farmers, rather? Why do we need to guard them? Well, are we using them for medical here or they\u2019re just getting used?<\/p>\n
The Dark Reality of Drug Money and Corruption<\/p>\n
JOE ROGAN: No, it\u2019s money. It\u2019s money. There\u2019s people, there\u2019s dirty money that gets moved around. For sure. When you\u2019re dealing with something like the drug trade and billions of dollars are going all over, people want a piece of that.<\/p>\n
And there\u2019s high level people that are dirty and they get involved in that and they make decisions based on that, and they put people\u2019s lives at risk and people die because of it. And that probably happened in Afghanistan and definitely happened in Vietnam.<\/p>\n
And people don\u2019t want to believe that. People are hearing this right now. \u201cOh, stop with that nonsense.\u201d But it\u2019s true. I mean, there\u2019s a video of Geraldo Rivera interviewing these military guys that were guarding poppy fields in Afghanistan. And the guy who\u2019s interviewing is very reluctant to talk about it, but it was on Fox News and he had to talk about it because everybody was aware of it. It was becoming a big conspiracy online.<\/p>\n
And they were coming up with some sort of irrational reason why they needed to guard their heroin production. Because, you know, \u201cwe need them to tell on the Taliban\u201d and like, really?<\/p>\n
GABLE STEVESON: Really.<\/p>\n
JOE ROGAN: So we\u2019re letting the farmers poison young people and heroin addicts all over the world because we want them to give us information about. Is that really what\u2019s going on? Or are you motherf*ers making money out of this?<\/p>\n
GABLE STEVESON: They got to be making a lot of money too. A lot of money. A lot of money. Well, I just saw the story about that guy from. He was a football player from Australia. He was selling drugs. What was that story? He was. He\u2019s not from Australia. He went to USC. Quarterback.<\/p>\n
JOE ROGAN: He was selling drugs.<\/p>\n
GABLE STEVESON: He was selling drugs out of an apartment in Australia for a cartel that was from Tijuana. I forgot his name. It\u2019s his quarterback. I feel like a lot of people know it.<\/p>\n
JOE ROGAN: It\u2019s a real recent story.<\/p>\n
GABLE STEVESON: It\u2019s a real story. A recent story from recent. From what I\u2019ve seen, it might be older. It might be like a couple years older. But yeah, he got caught because someone along the way was a middleman for a lot of. Yeah.<\/p>\n
JOE ROGAN: Wild, true story behind cocaine Quarterback signal caller for the cartel. Wow.<\/p>\n
GABLE STEVESON: And they said he was making like a million dollars a day in cash. And he was trying to move it through Las Vegas casinos. But the middleman, someone messed up the bet and he lost the money. So he had a loan money from someone. And that someone was like an undercover waiting for him like a year later and caught him at a McDonald\u2019s before he went across the road to Tijuana or something.<\/p>\n
It\u2019s crazy, yo. You know, drugs control a lot of things and it\u2019s messed up.<\/p>\n
JOE ROGAN: Well, it\u2019s the money. When you think about how much money gets moved around in the drug game, people get tempted by that. And then, you know, you get a hold of some legitimate businessman and say, \u201cListen, there\u2019s a way for you to get 10x return on your money. You know, you invest in this. We do that. It\u2019s simple. You\u2019ll never get dirty. All the money goes to offshore accounts. No one will know about it. You can retire when you\u2019re 45.\u201d<\/p>\n
GABLE STEVESON: Crazy.<\/p>\n
JOE ROGAN: And then people start getting roped. And it\u2019s also, it\u2019s the excitement of doing something naughty. That\u2019s part of it too. Some people just get, you know, like, some people like to ride bulls. Some people like to do some shit they\u2019re not supposed to do. They get addicted to doing things that they are not supposed to do. They get addicted to the life. DEA agents. A lot of DEA agents become drug dealers.<\/p>\n
GABLE STEVESON: Well, it\u2019s just like that show Narcos Mexico. Yes. It\u2019s the same thing.<\/p>\n
JOE ROGAN: Exactly, exactly, exactly. Or Cocaine Cowboys. Have you ever watched that documentary?<\/p>\n
GABLE STEVESON: No. What\u2019s that about?<\/p>\n
Cocaine Cowboys and Miami\u2019s Corruption<\/p>\n
JOE ROGAN: Amazing. Cocaine Cowboys 1, and then there\u2019s Cocaine Cowboys 2. There was so much corruption in Miami during the 1980s during the cocaine crime, that one graduating class of the police academy, the entire graduating class either wound up murdered or in jail.<\/p>\n
GABLE STEVESON: How do you do that?<\/p>\n
JOE ROGAN: Because they were all corrupt. They were all involved in cocaine dealing with all of them because there was so much money. Everybody\u2019s driving a Corvette, everybody\u2019s living large, everybody\u2019s doing blow and wearing diamonds.<\/p>\n
GABLE STEVESON: It\u2019s crazy.<\/p>\n
JOE ROGAN: It\u2019s like you get caught up in that life and if you\u2019re involved in, like, is your police officer and everybody around you is dirty, you know, like, it\u2019s more likely you\u2019re going to be dirty, too.<\/p>\n
GABLE STEVESON: Well, now. Now, aren\u2019t they kind of blowing the Ecuadorian ships up that are coming to here that are having a lot of drugs on them?<\/p>\n
JOE ROGAN: Yeah, Venezuela, right?<\/p>\n
GABLE STEVESON: Venezuelan ships. Yeah, they just blowing them up. I don\u2019t even know. I\u2019m not educated on stuff like that, but I wonder if it\u2019s for. To keep the trade here.<\/p>\n
JOE ROGAN: No, I doubt it. I think more likely what it is is because Trump genuinely hates that they\u2019re bringing drugs into this country. Is there other things involved, too? I don\u2019t know. I mean, I\u2019m sure some of it has to do with perhaps with politics. I mean, I think that\u2019s a reasonable assumption.<\/p>\n
But, Jamie, I just sent you something. Here\u2019s what\u2019s interesting. One of the things that Trump was saying is \u201cthey\u2019re poisoning our kids\u201d and that 100,000 people are dying every year from drug overdoses. \u201cWe have to put a stop to this.\u201d<\/p>\n
From the time Trump\u2019s been in office, deaths by overdose have dropped off a cliff. Look at that. Look at 2024 and leading into 2025. Look at that. These are all deaths from overdoses. I mean, that\u2019s kind of crazy. Like, look at that. From all drugs, which is the top one? Look at that drop. I mean, that\u2019s crazy.<\/p>\n
So you see, the peak in. Was in 2022, or it looks like actually 2020. Between 2023 and 2024, that\u2019s the peak where people are dying. And then from the time Trump\u2019s in office, it\u2019s taking a f*ing sharp downturn.<\/p>\n
And why is that? Well, part of it\u2019s because they\u2019re blowing up these f*ing boats that are bringing in all the drugs, and not just drugs, but drugs that are tainted with fentanyl.<\/p>\n
The Fentanyl Crisis<\/p>\n
GABLE STEVESON: Fentanyl is terrible.<\/p>\n
JOE ROGAN: Terrible.<\/p>\n
GABLE STEVESON: Because a little piece can kill you.<\/p>\n
JOE ROGAN: Exactly. It\u2019s smaller than a penny and you\u2019re dead.<\/p>\n
GABLE STEVESON: And people are snorting lines of it.<\/p>\n
JOE ROGAN: And they don\u2019t even know what\u2019s in there. And the cartel, they\u2019re buying, you know, they\u2019re taking shitty drugs and mixing it with fentanyl. So it has an effect. And people are getting it from what they think is a Xanax, and it\u2019s not a Xanax, it\u2019s fake, and it\u2019s got Fentanyl in it. And they\u2019re dying from that. They\u2019re dying from coke, that they think it\u2019s coke and fentanyl\u2019s in that. You know, it\u2019s horrible.<\/p>\n
GABLE STEVESON: There\u2019s so much access to things in this world right now that I feel like there\u2019s so many attainable things that people don\u2019t even think about that a lot of shit happens in this world that we just have no clue.<\/p>\n
And it\u2019s kind of weird and I just don\u2019t know, like, kind of the variety that I\u2019m bringing to the combo. But I\u2019m just saying it, like out of just to say it. But it\u2019s different. There\u2019s like a social media. You can meet so many people and just going to random places and meeting people, and then you can get roped up in the wrong things. And it\u2019s 100% of the downhill starts.<\/p>\n
JOE ROGAN: Yep. You take a bad turn and next thing you know, you\u2019re on a bad road and you keep going. You know, \u201ceventually I\u2019m going to get out of this game.\u201d And no, then you\u2019re in jail or you\u2019re dead.<\/p>\n
Ed Calderon\u2019s guy\u2019s been on this podcast many times. He used to work for the Mexican military. Now he\u2019s an American citizen, but he\u2019s a cartel expert. And you know the stories that he\u2019s told us about the f*ing cartel and the amount of money they have. I mean, they essentially, they have giant military operations. It\u2019s all cartel. The car. And they go to war with each other. It\u2019s crazy.<\/p>\n
GABLE STEVESON: Is it Pablo Escobar that had the money in the walls of his house?<\/p>\n
JOE ROGAN: I mean, probably, I don\u2019t know.<\/p>\n
GABLE STEVESON: Or who died. And he buried it all over in different places.<\/p>\n
JOE ROGAN: I\u2019m sure they all do that. I\u2019m sure Escobar did that. I think they all do that. They have so much money. That was one of the things of cocaine cowboys was this pilot. They had millions of dollars buried in his backyard. He would just take garbage bags, fill it with millions of dollars of cash, dig a big hole in the backyard and bury it there because he couldn\u2019t bring into a bank.<\/p>\n
GABLE STEVESON: Why not just give it away?<\/p>\n
JOE ROGAN: I\u2019ll f* give it away. Because they\u2019re doing coke and they want more money. They just don\u2019t know what to do with it, you know. And they can\u2019t just have it all laying around their house. And someone will break in their house and kill them and take their money.<\/p>\n
GABLE STEVESON: It\u2019s like, then it\u2019s over with.<\/p>\n
JOE ROGAN: It is a crazy game, but I can\u2019t recommend that documentary enough Cocaine Cowboys. You watch it, you go, \u201cwhat the f*.\u201d<\/p>\n
GABLE STEVESON: Where\u2019s the streamed at?<\/p>\n
JOE ROGAN: It\u2019s probably on everywhere. Where is Cocaine Cowboys?<\/p>\n
GABLE STEVESON: Got to get it. Sounds like Amazon Prime.<\/p>\n
JOE ROGAN: I\u2019m sure it\u2019s on everything. It might even be on Netflix. But it\u2019s incredible because you realize like, wow, like cocaine built Miami. Miami had more banks per capita. I don\u2019t know if it still does, but at one point in time, more banks per capita than any other city in the country. And it\u2019s because those banks were laundering money.<\/p>\n
GABLE STEVESON: Damn.<\/p>\n
JOE ROGAN: They were laundering cocaine money. It was all coming in.<\/p>\n
GABLE STEVESON: And Miami never sleeps either. So it was all night affair. Yeah.<\/p>\n
Jon Jones\u2019 Mentorship and Staying Disciplined<\/p>\n
JOE ROGAN: That is a crazy f*ing town. That is not a good town. If you want to be a fighter and live like a low key, disciplined life.<\/p>\n
GABLE STEVESON: No, you can. All of a sudden you\u2019re here, then you end up here, then all of a sudden it\u2019s 8am. Right? You\u2019re at the beach at 12. Can\u2019t be right. No, can\u2019t be right. That\u2019s a dark hole that a lot of people should not be in. But how do you get out though?<\/p>\n
JOE ROGAN: I don\u2019t know. Ask John. I mean, he seems to have navigated those waters better than anybody, you know, because usually it ruins everything in your life. He\u2019s obviously had some missteps but still comes out the greatest, you know, which is not everybody\u2019s path, you know.<\/p>\n
But obviously John is smart in that he spends a lot of time doing the things that he wants to do. Spends a lot of time training his dog, doing, you know, tactical stuff. He\u2019s always shooting guns and training and you know, you got to have things outside of that life, you know, that you enjoy other than just partying.<\/p>\n
GABLE STEVESON: Yeah, you got to have fun. You got to have some type of gap and some release. Yeah, and he\u2019s got a, he\u2019s got a good release and he\u2019s got a good mentality of what the release should be and how it should go and where he needs to go with it.<\/p>\n
And then, I mean, I\u2019ve been with him now since we have this close connection. I\u2019ve been with him to two places and he\u2019s always, he\u2019s always kept me on a straight path, and which is really, really nice. You know, a lot of people that may have, you know, like to like to take shots or like to do something like that. You know, there\u2019s always a little man.<\/p>\n
JOE ROGAN: Do you want one? Right?<\/p>\n
GABLE STEVESON: But there\u2019s never. There\u2019s never been a time where he\u2019s like, \u201cMan, I think you should try.\u201d And it\u2019s great, because as an older. As a younger kid that\u2019s coming up, he sees the potential, and that\u2019s all that matters. And I just need someone to see it. And, man, he\u2019s been great with it, for sure. Yeah.<\/p>\n
JOE ROGAN: When you\u2019re around a bunch of people that party and they drag you into that world, it\u2019s so easy for people to get hooked. It\u2019s so easy for people to just get roped into that lifestyle, because people essentially, for the most part, imitate their atmosphere.<\/p>\n
And if you\u2019re around that kind of an atmosphere, those are the type of people that you\u2019re with, and those are the type of thrills that they\u2019re seeking. You can get caught up in that, you know, and it\u2019s the bane of every fighter\u2019s existence is women in partying. Yeah.<\/p>\n
GABLE STEVESON: He\u2019s always been like, \u201cHey, you got to stay. You got to stay clean. Go home.\u201d And that\u2019s been the best part about it.<\/p>\n
The Timeline and UFC Negotiations<\/p>\n
JOE ROGAN: That\u2019s great, man. That is f*ing great. So what is the timeline right now? Have you signed a deal with the UFC? I know they\u2019re talking to you. What\u2019s going on?<\/p>\n
GABLE STEVESON: Yeah, they\u2019ve reached out many times, but I told them I\u2019m kind of on the lines of right now, I\u2019m waiting for my little girl to come out. So January is kind of a dead month for me.<\/p>\n
JOE ROGAN: But are you signed with the UFC?<\/p>\n
GABLE STEVESON: No, no, I\u2019m not signing anybody.<\/p>\n
JOE ROGAN: Have they offered you a fight yet?<\/p>\n
GABLE STEVESON: Yeah, they\u2019ve reached out about a couple things, but no one specific. They just offer dates.<\/p>\n
JOE ROGAN: Do you want to have fights in other organizations first? One of the problems with a guy like you is that you\u2019re so talented that you could have 12 fights in the UFC and all of a sudden be fighting a top contender, which I think you would do well.<\/p>\n
But if I was a manager of a boxer and a guy with your potential, I would do what Cus D\u2019Amato did with Mike Tyson. You have him fight a bunch of different guys, like you did with dirty boxing. Small organization MMA fights, build up those skills, get experience while you\u2019re constantly training and growing and getting better. And then once you enter into the UFC, you\u2019re essentially already the champion. It\u2019s just nobody knows it yet.<\/p>\n
GABLE STEVESON: I would really like to debut at the White House.<\/p>\n
JOE ROGAN: Debut?<\/p>\n
GABLE STEVESON: I would like to debut at the White House. I would like to do one or two more fights before then, and then if I can sign, do a big release, \u201cHey, he signed. Good job.\u201d And then debuted at the White House. That\u2019s my perfect world.<\/p>\n
JOE ROGAN: Is it hard to get fights right now?<\/p>\n
GABLE STEVESON: Maybe a little bit. I don\u2019t ask. I just say yes, and then just keep moving. I kind of leave it up to Jon to watch the people and all the coaches to watch and see what goes on. But I mean, if a guy says no, there\u2019s no hard feelings. I mean, just keep it pushing, and hopefully I can get to the guy that says yes.<\/p>\n
JOE ROGAN: That\u2019s the problem is that when a guy gets so much hype around him, there\u2019s a lot of guys who want to eventually be a world champion and go, \u201cI\u2019m not ready for this guy yet.\u201d Good guys. This guy\u2019s not on another level right now.<\/p>\n
GABLE STEVESON: But just when, if they do think that, just whenever you think you are ready, I will be there waiting.<\/p>\n
JOE ROGAN: That\u2019s terrifying.<\/p>\n
GABLE STEVESON: I will be there waiting. That\u2019s terrifying.<\/p>\n
JOE ROGAN: A lot of people heard that. I don\u2019t want to wait.<\/p>\n
GABLE STEVESON: I don\u2019t want to wait.<\/p>\n
JOE ROGAN: There\u2019s a mouth. But also, the smart move might be to get a hold of you now before you get better.<\/p>\n
GABLE STEVESON: You can try now, too.<\/p>\n
JOE ROGAN: But you know what I\u2019m saying.<\/p>\n
GABLE STEVESON: Yeah.<\/p>\n
JOE ROGAN: You know what I\u2019m saying? I mean, pick your poison.<\/p>\n
The Worst Version of Gable Steveson<\/p>\n
GABLE STEVESON: I mean, like I said, dirty boxing, and that last fight in November with that double leg, that\u2019s the worst I\u2019ll ever be. And it\u2019s kind of neat to repeat that to the world, to kind of let them get a refresher. That is the worst Gable Steveson will be, and the best is when he\u2019ll come back his next time. But after that, that\u2019s the last worst I\u2019ll ever be after that.<\/p>\n
JOE ROGAN: So do you have a blueprint, like a map of where, what you\u2019d like to accomplish in your career?<\/p>\n
GABLE STEVESON: Yes.<\/p>\n
JOE ROGAN: Long term.<\/p>\n
GABLE STEVESON: Yeah, long term. I\u2019d like to be champion, UFC champion. I think Stipe has about five defenses, if I\u2019m not mistaken. I would like to try to beat that record if I can, and if I can\u2019t, die trying.<\/p>\n
I played in the NFL. I won the Olympics. I would just like to be just an overall good man. A lot of people want to look at, like we just talked about, a lot of people want to look at the success, the money. I just want to be an excellent man.<\/p>\n
I want to look back and be like, \u201cDamn, Gable did that.\u201d And I saw Dana White, he had a picture, and he said, \u201cLet your last name be the reason that people remember you.\u201d And I want the Steveson last name to be something that people remember, and I want them to look at me and be like, \u201cDamn, through the peaks and valleys, Gable stood up and he became someone in his life, and he provided for his family, and he went home healthy,\u201d and that\u2019s what I want.<\/p>\n
Championship\u2019s going to come, but I feel like a lot of people are so obsessed with \u201cI got to do this,\u201d but I\u2019m obsessed with being the best version of Gable, because if I\u2019m the best version of Gable, you\u2019re not going to be able to beat me.<\/p>\n
JOE ROGAN: Keep that mindset, and you will accomplish these things, my man.<\/p>\n
GABLE STEVESON: I appreciate it.<\/p>\n
JOE ROGAN: I believe it. Well, I appreciate it. Thank you very much for being here.<\/p>\n
GABLE STEVESON: Yes. You already know.<\/p>\n
JOE ROGAN: Pleasure.<\/p>\n
GABLE STEVESON: Thank you.<\/p>\n
JOE ROGAN: And I can\u2019t wait to see you fight in the UFC, man.<\/p>\n
GABLE STEVESON: I can\u2019t wait to do it.<\/p>\n
JOE ROGAN: Going to be fun. Thank you. All right. Thank you. Bye, everybody.<\/p>\n
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