{"id":402422,"date":"2026-01-11T11:00:11","date_gmt":"2026-01-11T11:00:11","guid":{"rendered":"https:\/\/www.newsbeep.com\/ca\/402422\/"},"modified":"2026-01-11T11:00:11","modified_gmt":"2026-01-11T11:00:11","slug":"my-plans-for-in-our-time-we-have-to-compete-with-the-rest-is-history","status":"publish","type":"post","link":"https:\/\/www.newsbeep.com\/ca\/402422\/","title":{"rendered":"My plans for In Our Time \u2014 \u2018We have to compete with The Rest Is History\u2019"},"content":{"rendered":"<p>During his 27 years at the helm of Radio 4\u2019s In Our Time, Melvyn Bragg bestowed on his discussion programme the unofficial motto, \u201cNever knowingly relevant\u201d. While many other radio shows strive for topicality and modern relevance, In Our Time has waltzed at will between intellectual explorations of plate tectonics, 17th-century vases, philosophical theories and Algeria\u2019s 1871 Mokrani Revolt against French rule. <\/p>\n<p>Misha Glenny, the man charged with filling Bragg\u2019s well-worn shoes, feels that \u201cnever knowingly relevant\u201d did a slight disservice to his predecessor\u2019s work, guiding listeners through academic discussions on history, philosophy, science, art and more. \u201cWhat I have always noticed is that it\u2019s usually unknowingly relevant,\u201d Glenny observes, shortly before his first programme is due on the airwaves on Thursday.<\/p>\n<p class=\"responsive__Paragraph-sc-1pktst5-0 gaEeqC\">His point is that discussions about distant periods of history often contain \u201cechoes\u201d that resonate now, in a time of \u201cgreat turmoil and great change \u2014 socially, politically, economically and technologically\u201d. \u201cIf you\u2019re talking about, say, the Reformation and the polarisation of society that took place very dramatically and violently in [the 16th century], you cannot help but hear the echoes about what we\u2019re all experiencing today,\u201d he says. \u201cSo I will be aware of that relevance, even if I want to keep it largely unknowing.\u201d <\/p>\n<p class=\"responsive__Paragraph-sc-1pktst5-0 gaEeqC\">This may provide some clue as to how Glenny, 67, plans to approach the task of anchoring a programme that was launched experimentally by Bragg in 1998 and has risen to become an institution of British radio. <\/p>\n<p class=\"responsive__Paragraph-sc-1pktst5-0 gaEeqC\">On the face of it, the success of In Our Time, which reportedly attracts two million listeners a week, doesn\u2019t make much sense. In the social media age, when we\u2019ve all apparently had enough of experts, how does anyone find time to listen to a 45-minute discussion between three academics calmly chaired by a no-frills BBC host? Glenny says: \u201cWe are inherently curious. And if you can get somebody to explain something, which is actually a vital part of one\u2019s experience but you\u2019ve never actually understood it, in a way that makes it comprehensible, then you\u2019re on to a winner.\u201d<\/p>\n<p class=\"responsive__Paragraph-sc-1pktst5-0 gaEeqC\">In Our Time has also become one of BBC Sounds\u2019 most popular podcasts with those aged under 35. So much for dwindling attention spans, eh? \u201cThe attention span thing doesn\u2019t just affect under-35s, it affects all of us,\u201d says Glenny, who forces himself to separate from his mobile phone for at least two hours a day so he can read and concentrate. <\/p>\n<p class=\"responsive__Paragraph-sc-1pktst5-0 gaEeqC\">\u2022 <a href=\"https:\/\/www.thetimes.com\/culture\/tv-radio\/article\/melvyn-bragg-steelworks-didnt-want-me-so-i-tried-the-bbc-c02wwsdxq\" class=\"link__RespLink-sc-1ocvixa-0 csWvlP\" rel=\"nofollow noopener\" target=\"_blank\">Melvyn Bragg at 85: \u2018I don\u2019t see the point of retiring\u2019<\/a><\/p>\n<p class=\"responsive__Paragraph-sc-1pktst5-0 gaEeqC\">\u201cI know my attention span has been hammered since the advent of the smartphone,\u201d he adds. \u201cFor young people, it must be exhausting following TikTok the whole time and all the other distractions that are going on \u2014 utterly shattering and exhausting. And just to listen and consider is a really valuable thing that this programme offers to the audience.\u201d <\/p>\n<p class=\"responsive__Paragraph-sc-1pktst5-0 gaEeqC\">So, who is In Our Time\u2019s new frontman? Brought up in London and Oxford, the son of the Russian literature translator Michael, Glenny studied German and drama at the University of Bristol. He flirted with the idea of becoming an actor but \u201cvery sensibly, I decided against that\u201d. <\/p>\n<p class=\"responsive__Paragraph-sc-1pktst5-0 gaEeqC\">Instead, he pursued linguistics \u2014 he can speak German, Czech, Serbo-Croat, Portuguese and French, with \u201csmatterings of Hungarian and Albanian\u201d \u2014 before a career in journalism beckoned. He made his name reporting for the BBC on the Balkan wars and latterly as a writer of books. He wrote McMafia, about post-Soviet Union corruption, and was an executive producer on the BBC drama series of the same name, which <a href=\"https:\/\/www.thetimes.com\/culture\/tv-radio\/article\/interview-actor-james-norton-and-screenwriter-hossein-amini-on-the-new-bbc-drama-mcmafia-vqqz0mxr5\" class=\"link__RespLink-sc-1ocvixa-0 csWvlP\" rel=\"nofollow noopener\" target=\"_blank\">starred James Norton<\/a>.<\/p>\n<p><img decoding=\"async\" alt=\"Alex Godman (James Norton) in a suit.\" loading=\"lazy\" src=\"https:\/\/www.newsbeep.com\/ca\/wp-content\/uploads\/2026\/01\/\/6c6d0df1-743b-4c41-8152-cebf4bd17683.jpg\" class=\"responsive-sc-1nnon4d-0 bAbKns\"\/><\/p>\n<p>Glenny wrote McMafia and was an executive producer on the BBC drama series of the same name, which starred James Norton<\/p>\n<p>NICK WALL\/BBC<\/p>\n<p class=\"responsive__Paragraph-sc-1pktst5-0 gaEeqC\">Clearly, Glenny, who has served as the rector of Vienna\u2019s Institute for Human Sciences since 2022, and is the husband of his fellow BBC broadcaster Kirsty Lang, has the bona fides for In Our Time, but his appointment still came as a surprise to many. <\/p>\n<p class=\"responsive__Paragraph-sc-1pktst5-0 gaEeqC\">Stephen Fry, the household name, former QI presenter and sometime actor, had been tipped as the man to breathe new life into Bragg\u2019s old show. \u201cI was told that Stephen didn\u2019t apply,\u201d Glenny says, politely ignoring a subtle invitation to look down his nose at last year\u2019s <a href=\"https:\/\/www.thetimes.com\/culture\/tv-radio\/article\/next-series-celebrity-traitors-z899t6l3z\" class=\"link__RespLink-sc-1ocvixa-0 csWvlP\" rel=\"nofollow noopener\" target=\"_blank\">The Celebrity Traitors<\/a> contestant. \u201cThere was apparently a lot of mythology around [Fry getting the job]. Of course, he would have been very brilliant, precisely because he\u2019s such a polymath and so erudite and a great talker.\u201d <\/p>\n<p class=\"responsive__Paragraph-sc-1pktst5-0 gaEeqC\">Glenny seems intent on not rocking the boat when he makes his debut on In Our Time. \u201cI will not be going in like a bulldozer,\u201d is how he puts it. \u201cMelvyn\u2019s legacy is absolutely huge and I want to build on that rather than demolish it.\u201d <\/p>\n<p class=\"responsive__Paragraph-sc-1pktst5-0 gaEeqC\">He says the show\u2019s three producers and editor will \u201cset the agenda entirely for the first couple of months or so \u2014 they\u2019ve already got a whole series of topics lined up. But after that I want to do it in collaboration with them.\u201d He has his sights set on the Seven Years\u2019 War and microchips. <\/p>\n<p class=\"responsive__Paragraph-sc-1pktst5-0 gaEeqC\">Glenny\u2019s challenges will stretch beyond merely filling the void left by the much-loved Bragg, 86. Like the BBC at large, In Our Time needs to fight to retain relevance in an age when the state-owned broadcaster is losing ground to digital media. <\/p>\n<p class=\"responsive__Paragraph-sc-1pktst5-0 gaEeqC\">\u2022 <a href=\"https:\/\/www.thetimes.com\/culture\/tv-radio\/article\/melvyn-bragg-art-matters-the-decameron-ben-dowell-7xn0ljnpc\" class=\"link__RespLink-sc-1ocvixa-0 csWvlP\" rel=\"nofollow noopener\" target=\"_blank\">Melvyn Braggs\u2019s manifesto for magic moments<\/a><\/p>\n<p class=\"responsive__Paragraph-sc-1pktst5-0 gaEeqC\">It\u2019s difficult not to view The Rest Is History, Dominic Sandbrook and Tom Holland\u2019s wildly popular podcast, as a direct competitor, with listeners moving away from radio schedules and towards Spotify. And their success is encouraging others to have a go. Even Piers Morgan has a history podcast (although History Uncensored, while produced by Morgan\u2019s company, is hosted by the former CNN anchor Bianca Nobilo). <\/p>\n<p class=\"responsive__Paragraph-sc-1pktst5-0 gaEeqC\">\u201cMy hat goes off to them,\u201d Glenny says of Sandbrook and Holland. \u201cJust as In Our Time evolved under Melvyn, it will evolve under me, if only because the media environment is different and you have to find ways of competing with shows like The Rest Is History without simply aping them.\u201d <\/p>\n<p class=\"responsive__Paragraph-sc-1pktst5-0 gaEeqC\">Glenny\u2019s plan, after settling his feet under the In Our Time desk, is to find ways \u201cforward in a world that is dominated by <a href=\"https:\/\/www.thetimes.com\/topic\/tiktok\" class=\"link__RespLink-sc-1ocvixa-0 csWvlP\" rel=\"nofollow noopener\" target=\"_blank\">TikTok<\/a>, by podcasts, where the BBC\u2019s radio monopoly has effectively been breached and it needs to react in a different way\u201d. But he has no interest in pursuing the popular \u201ctalking-heads podcast\u201d approach. <\/p>\n<p class=\"responsive__Paragraph-sc-1pktst5-0 gaEeqC\">Many podcasts stretch out their discussions on topics over several hours or even multiple episodes. The Rest Is History, for instance, recently released a five-part series on Jack the Ripper. Might In Our Time extend its discussions beyond the standard 45 minutes? <\/p>\n<p class=\"responsive__Paragraph-sc-1pktst5-0 gaEeqC\">\u2022 <a href=\"https:\/\/www.thetimes.com\/culture\/tv-radio\/article\/how-to-make-a-podcast-the-expert-guide-g8cd5pp6q\" class=\"link__RespLink-sc-1ocvixa-0 csWvlP\" rel=\"nofollow noopener\" target=\"_blank\">How to make a podcast \u2014 the expert guide<\/a><\/p>\n<p class=\"responsive__Paragraph-sc-1pktst5-0 gaEeqC\">Glenny wrinkles his nose. \u201cI can\u2019t imagine doing the Reformation, Luther and the German princes stretching out over five episodes. It would be really hard to hold the audience,\u201d he says. \u201cJack the Ripper is slightly different because there\u2019s always been the kind of whodunnit and salacious aspect to Jack the Ripper, which is endlessly entertaining and attractive to people. I know The Rest Is History does very serious subjects but the sorts of subjects we want to do wouldn\u2019t lend themselves to that.\u201d <\/p>\n<p class=\"responsive__Paragraph-sc-1pktst5-0 gaEeqC\">When I ask Glenny to name his favourite radio shows and podcasts apart from In Our Time, he tells me Czech public radio is \u201cfantastic\u201d. At home, he enjoys Radio 4\u2019s Start the Week, Feedback and long-form documentary dramas such as Glenn Patterson\u2019s The Brighton Bomb. The BBC will be pleased with its new presenter\u2019s brand loyalty. <\/p>\n<p class=\"responsive__Paragraph-sc-1pktst5-0 gaEeqC\">\u2022 <a href=\"https:\/\/www.thetimes.com\/culture\/tv-radio\/article\/ive-listened-to-every-episode-of-in-our-time-these-are-the-15-best-827p29hcb\" class=\"link__RespLink-sc-1ocvixa-0 csWvlP\" rel=\"nofollow noopener\" target=\"_blank\">I\u2019ve listened to every episode of In Our Time. These are the 15 best<\/a><\/p>\n<p class=\"responsive__Paragraph-sc-1pktst5-0 gaEeqC\">\u201cIt\u2019s very difficult now outside of the BBC to hear structured documentaries, which are not just people talking about what they think about a subject,\u201d Glenny says. \u201cMost of the shows made outside of the BBC now are talking-heads podcasts, which is fine.\u201d But not, I sense, Glenny\u2019s cup of tea? \u201cWell, I don\u2019t mind it,\u201d he says evenly. \u201cBut a well-produced documentary or feature \u2026 it\u2019s a very different experience.\u201d <\/p>\n<p class=\"responsive__Paragraph-sc-1pktst5-0 gaEeqC\">Before letting Glenny go, I must ask him \u2014 after Bragg\u2019s 27-year stint \u2014 how long he expects to be presenting In Our Time. \u201cI promise you,\u201d he says, \u201cI won\u2019t be doing it as long as Melvyn.\u201d<\/p>\n<p class=\"responsive__Paragraph-sc-1pktst5-0 gaEeqC\">What topics would you like to see featured on In Our Time? Let us know in the comments below<\/p>\n<p>The first weekly episode of In Our Time presented by Misha Glenny is on BBC Radio 4 and BBC Sounds on Thursday, January 15 at 9am. McMafia: Seriously Organised Crime by Misha Glenny is published by Vintage, \u00a310.99<\/p>\n","protected":false},"excerpt":{"rendered":"During his 27 years at the helm of Radio 4\u2019s In Our Time, Melvyn Bragg bestowed on his&hellip;\n","protected":false},"author":2,"featured_media":402423,"comment_status":"","ping_status":"","sticky":false,"template":"","format":"standard","meta":{"footnotes":""},"categories":[28],"tags":[49,48,75,341],"class_list":{"0":"post-402422","1":"post","2":"type-post","3":"status-publish","4":"format-standard","5":"has-post-thumbnail","7":"category-music","8":"tag-ca","9":"tag-canada","10":"tag-entertainment","11":"tag-music"},"_links":{"self":[{"href":"https:\/\/www.newsbeep.com\/ca\/wp-json\/wp\/v2\/posts\/402422","targetHints":{"allow":["GET"]}}],"collection":[{"href":"https:\/\/www.newsbeep.com\/ca\/wp-json\/wp\/v2\/posts"}],"about":[{"href":"https:\/\/www.newsbeep.com\/ca\/wp-json\/wp\/v2\/types\/post"}],"author":[{"embeddable":true,"href":"https:\/\/www.newsbeep.com\/ca\/wp-json\/wp\/v2\/users\/2"}],"replies":[{"embeddable":true,"href":"https:\/\/www.newsbeep.com\/ca\/wp-json\/wp\/v2\/comments?post=402422"}],"version-history":[{"count":0,"href":"https:\/\/www.newsbeep.com\/ca\/wp-json\/wp\/v2\/posts\/402422\/revisions"}],"wp:featuredmedia":[{"embeddable":true,"href":"https:\/\/www.newsbeep.com\/ca\/wp-json\/wp\/v2\/media\/402423"}],"wp:attachment":[{"href":"https:\/\/www.newsbeep.com\/ca\/wp-json\/wp\/v2\/media?parent=402422"}],"wp:term":[{"taxonomy":"category","embeddable":true,"href":"https:\/\/www.newsbeep.com\/ca\/wp-json\/wp\/v2\/categories?post=402422"},{"taxonomy":"post_tag","embeddable":true,"href":"https:\/\/www.newsbeep.com\/ca\/wp-json\/wp\/v2\/tags?post=402422"}],"curies":[{"name":"wp","href":"https:\/\/api.w.org\/{rel}","templated":true}]}}