“The scrum has gone too far now and I am not sure you can get it back,” Wheeler says. “The referees seem to allow… when was the last time there was a free-kick for a not-straight scrum feed? The game has changed in that respect. The hooker now is another back-row forward apart from the line-out. Certainly, a lot of skills I had as a hooker are not necessarily as relevant now. Striking at a scrum, for instance.”

It is fitting that Wheeler cites two hookers – Philippe Dintrans and Bobby Windsor – as two of his toughest opponents as well as a particular scrum as one of his most cherished rugby memories. The set-piece in question came at Murrayfield in 1980, the day that wing John Carleton scored a hat-trick as England sealed their first Grand Slam for 23 years. Wheeler describes the scrum for Carleton’s second try as “turbo-charged”.

“The pack were remarkable that game against Scotland,” Wheeler says. “I remember one of the scrums, five metres out, we went for a pushover try. It was like it was turbo-charged. As we put the ball in, we drove them over the line. John very nearly did not have to do anything except touch it down.”

One of the most controversial moments of Wheeler’s playing career came in 1983, when many felt that he was a shoo-in to captain the ultimately underwhelming Lions tour of New Zealand. But Wheeler was not even included in the final touring party for what would have been his third expedition with the famous touring side.

“They had their reasons,” Wheeler says. “They thought it would be difficult for me to go and not be captain.

“The squad was announced on the Monday after we had played in Ireland and we were still there. Ian Robertson of the BBC said that he would give me a ring once the squad had been released to the press. I had a telephone call from him at 7am in the middle of Dublin, at the Shelbourne Hotel, having obviously had a night with the boys after the game, and he just said: ‘They’ve not picked you.’ It wasn’t that I wasn’t fussed – I was terribly – it was more that I could not get upset because of all the other things I had done. I was disappointed. I was 34, pushing 35. But, of course, it had an effect on the team. Not because it was me but just because it became something. The tour didn’t do so well. They needed to win the first Test, they didn’t, and then it got harder and harder.”

Before I take my leave, having had far too much of the Wheelers’ time and biscuits, there is the chance for a final discussion of his beloved Leicester, where he went from player to captain to coach to chief executive to board member over a 46-year period, starting in 1969. I ask what it was like managing some of the biggest characters in English rugby. “Like who?” he asks. Well, Dean Richards, for starters.

‘I had to sack Dean. God knows I didn’t want to’

“Oh, Dean, yeah,” he giggles. “We had a good side, didn’t we. That mid-90s to early 2000s. But I had to sack him. God knows I didn’t want to. There was a problem staring you in the face and you had to deal with it. Who was the coach before him? Yes, that’s it, Bob Dwyer. I had to sack him, too. Dean was a great coach; and a great man, full stop. That team was full of good players and good men.”

What about Austin Healey? Well, Wheeler cannot contain his laughter.