other immigration stories around the country<\/a>, Keith plans to return soon. \u201cI have some other things I want to follow up on,\u201d she says. \u201cIt\u2019s really a never-ending story.\u201d<\/p>\nWhat first brought you to Federal Plaza? What drew you to this story?<\/p>\n
It was right after Donald Trump was reelected and was going to radically expand ICE\u2019s budget. For me, that seemed like the No. 1 thing. He was transforming the country from a country of lawyers and judges and court appointments into this police state. So I felt like I needed to watch and see and try to show what this transformation was like and how it affected people. I started out thinking, Oh, I\u2019m going to sit in my car and drive off and find ICE here and there. And so I subscribed to all these ICE-alert systems. But I never saw a single agent anywhere. And then one day there was a protest at the federal courthouse on Varick Street. And activists had figured out that ICE was operating inside the courthouses and arresting people. That was when I realized, Okay, here is this new policy of the United States. Here it is in action, right in front of my eyes.<\/p>\n
And at that point, people didn\u2019t really think this was happening in New York.\u00a0
That\u2019s right. Because it was happening inside this random bureaucratic building.<\/p>\n
So upon arriving and being thrust into the chaos of it, what was your process like? How did you approach the actual day-to-day \u2014 and minute by minute \u2014\u00a0of actually taking these photos?
It was very chaotic \u2014 it\u2019s a very tiny space. The hallways were very narrow, and there were a lot of people, a lot of press. You just had to learn what courtrooms were active on which days and at what time. The agents might be spread out on a bunch of different floors, and you just have to say, \u201cWell, I\u2019m going to follow this story, or I\u2019m going to be here because there\u2019s not a lot of other press here.\u201d You just have to follow your gut.<\/p>\n
How did you manage the tension between yourself and your subjects? You\u2019re obviously there to capture a moment, but then this particular moment that you\u2019re capturing is the worst moment of people\u2019s lives. How did you deal with that?\u00a0
Well, there was a certain point where I was like, Okay, I\u2019ve photographed enough detentions. I wanted to try to tell more stories. So, you know, I started getting there a bit earlier so I could see who was arriving and create a kind of rapport with the subjects. Maybe nothing happened to them that day. But then maybe something heart-wrenching would happen later. The family that ended up on the cover \u2014\u00a0I was there the moment they arrived at the courthouse, and I tried to talk with them while they were waiting. When the father was actually taken away, I didn\u2019t photograph the detention at all. I just photographed the family\u2019s reaction.<\/p>\n
The nature of the kind of photography you do means that you\u2019re often in these really high intensity situations. But, on a personal level, did this assignment stand out for you in any way? Was there anything that made it particularly challenging?
Well, I mean, seeing these families being pulled apart \u2014\u00a0I have to admit, I\u2019ve never experienced anything like that before. In the moment, you try to keep it together and just stay focused. You\u2019re on a sort of emotional autopilot. But I remember that family in particular, I just burst into tears afterward. It was so sad, you know, they were such a happy family and they seemed so close. And from one minute to the next, they have a father and then they don\u2019t have a father.<\/p>\n
And then there were practical constraints. There was this man, Jamal, who was detained inside of a waiting room. And normally, you can\u2019t photograph in there. But, you know, normally there isn\u2019t extreme violence and chaos happening inside a waiting room. So I photographed it. Some photographers were afraid that if we published those photos, we\u2019d lose access to the courthouse altogether. But I just felt like, if there\u2019s something important happening, I have to document it.<\/p>\n
Yes, Natalia, Jamal\u2019s wife, said \u201cthe whole world came crashing down on him\u201d in that waiting room. Did you end up following his story or any others after the article was published?
I did follow Monica. She\u2019s the woman who is on the ground, and she was able to get her husband back. There\u2019s an amazing group of volunteers and people who work at the courthouses who are really trying to help these people. There was one woman who was in the written article \u2014\u00a0we couldn\u2019t publish her face because she had witnessed a gang murder back in Ecuador, and they were worried that she was going to be targeted if she was deported. She ended up being released and was reunited with her family. Her case actually became a precedent, and it has helped other people get out of detention.<\/p>\n
Jamal won his asylum case. But then ICE appealed the decision, and now it\u2019s under review. He wanted to be bonded out of detention, but the judge wouldn\u2019t allow it. So he is actually still in detention in western Pennsylvania, where he\u2019s been since the end of August. His lawyer did say that he thought that my pictures were really important in bringing that case to light and showing the entire arc of Jamal\u2019s story. I think, ultimately, people just didn\u2019t realize how brutal it really was.<\/p>\n
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